Ancestral Diet Dishonesty -- Hawaiian Edition
Forget the paleo diet for a moment here. Let's face it, nothing in the modern interpretations ever really came close to whatever that was anyway.
Forget hunter gatherers for a moment here. Let's face it, these cultures are isolated and generally irrelevant in every way to the "modern" agricultural world.
Let's even forget the diets of cultures around the globe from 300 or so years ago on back. Most corners of the world were "contaminated" by trade and transplantation of foodstuffs, livestock and plant species not indigenous to various regions.
No ... I'm talking about traditional regional diets that persisted in practice from the relatively recent past -- within a few hundred years -- through to a few generations ago.
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So next week there will be an online summit -- Reversing Diabetes World Summit -- co-hosted by none other than Jimmy Moore! (don't get me started there ...) There have been a couple of free sneak peeks including this one by an Asylum fave, Dr. Cate Shanahan.
The interviewer goes through her usual bio with the "she studied ethnobotany and her healthiest patients' culinary habits in Hawaii" schtick. At about the 1m:30s mark here are my quick notes (not official transcript):
Dr. Cate was practicing medicine in rural Hawaii? Treating healthy middle aged women who wouldn't have needed her doctoring anyway .... Ummm ....
Later in the interview she goes into her low carb, moderate protein, high fat diet schtick. Fat is where it's at for Cate, 50% or more the better! She sneaks fermented foods and bone broth in there too. Only athletes should consume more than 25% carb or protein in their diets. Sugar is sugar, so once it's in you, your body can't tell if it came from a Twinkie or a potato. Processing does stuff to proteins and enzymes and ... Oh I can't bother. Her biochemistry and nutrition is so backwards it is beyond words, and yet she is teaming with Mark Sisson to do metabolic counseling! Maybe they can get a Laker to do promos. But I digress. Anyone who reads her book and still considers her a reputable source of information discredits themselves. Yes ... it is that bad!
So first, let's get some facts straight. Hawaii does indeed have the longest average life expectancy in the US (oddly enough Latinos residing there have the lowest life expectancy for any state where itemized, Asians have higher life expectancies in all states where reported but not so much in Hawaii). I can't get the full text for these but, I think the abstracts give enough information to realize that the Native Hawaiians fare relatively poorly in the longevity department where statistics Shanahan is citing are concerned.
- When she relocated to Hawaii, state with the longest lifespan in US realized she was immersed in culture of healthy people who could teach her the secrets "genetic wealth"
- Strong joints, fertility, no gray to 50 yrs, strong nails, limbs proportioned according to "golden ratio", long nose, high cheek bones, full lips, strong jaw
- Reminds me (interviewer?) of hunter gatherer cultures around the world where people eat traditional diet and maintain health
- Her patients were employed in resorts, women in their 50's and 60's worked all day long, lifting, bending, scrubbing, reaching who would then go home and keep on working, make dinner for family and chase grandkids
- These women had beautiful skin, supple joints, few if any grays
- Each one had been raised in a rural area, raised as their parents and grandparents had been, on home grown fresh foods, prepared using simple traditional recipes
Dr. Cate was practicing medicine in rural Hawaii? Treating healthy middle aged women who wouldn't have needed her doctoring anyway .... Ummm ....
Later in the interview she goes into her low carb, moderate protein, high fat diet schtick. Fat is where it's at for Cate, 50% or more the better! She sneaks fermented foods and bone broth in there too. Only athletes should consume more than 25% carb or protein in their diets. Sugar is sugar, so once it's in you, your body can't tell if it came from a Twinkie or a potato. Processing does stuff to proteins and enzymes and ... Oh I can't bother. Her biochemistry and nutrition is so backwards it is beyond words, and yet she is teaming with Mark Sisson to do metabolic counseling! Maybe they can get a Laker to do promos. But I digress. Anyone who reads her book and still considers her a reputable source of information discredits themselves. Yes ... it is that bad!
So first, let's get some facts straight. Hawaii does indeed have the longest average life expectancy in the US (oddly enough Latinos residing there have the lowest life expectancy for any state where itemized, Asians have higher life expectancies in all states where reported but not so much in Hawaii). I can't get the full text for these but, I think the abstracts give enough information to realize that the Native Hawaiians fare relatively poorly in the longevity department where statistics Shanahan is citing are concerned.
Life tables by ethnic group for Hawaii, 1980: "Results show that: 1) female life expectancy at birth is 81 1/2 years; 2) male life expectancy is 75 years; and 3) life expectancy by ethnic group shows Chinese and Japanese rank the highest, Filipinos next highest, Caucasians and others have the next highest, and Hawaiians and part Hawaiians have the lowest. It is clear that marked mortality differentials remain between ethnic groups and between the sexes in Hawaii."
Life and death in Hawaii: ethnic variations in life expectancy and mortality, 1980 and 1990: "Life expectancy in Hawaii is among the highest in the nation. Past research, however, found significant ethnic differences in longevity. This study presents life expectancy estimations for 1980 and 1990, along with ethnic differences in mortality rates for specific causes of death. The findings suggest that ethnic differences continue, with Chinese and Japanese having the longest life expectancy and Native Hawaiians having the shortest."No doubt some degree of Westernizing of their diet factors in here, but let's put another oft-misrepresented traditional culture twist on this tale. Do you suppose the migration of Okinawans to Hawaii might factor in on this slightly?
Aaaanywaaaay. Let us presume that native Hawaiians consuming their native diet would be healthy and all else being equal fare well in Hawaii to this day (or at least until Cate returned to the mainland). What was their diet? High fat? Lotsa butter, broth and 'bucha? Oh of course not silly.
The Waianae Diet Program is a community-based intervention strategy designed to be culturally appropriate by using a pre-Western-contact Hawaiian diet to reduce chronic disease risk factors in Native Hawaiians. This paper describes a trial of the traditional Hawaiian diet fed ad libiturn to Native Hawaiians with multiple risk factors for cardiovascular disease to assess its effect on obesity and cardiovascular risk factors. Twenty Native Hawaiians were placed on a pre-Western-contact Hawaiian diet for 21 d. The diet was low in fat (7%), high in complex carbohydrates (78%), and moderate in protein (15%). Participants were encouraged to eat to satiety. Average energy intake decreased from 10.86 Mi (2594 kcal)/d to 6.57 MJ (1569 kcal)/d. Average weight loss was 7.8 kg and average serum cholesterol decreased 0.81 mmol/L from 5.76 to 4.95 mmol/L. Blood pressure decreased an average of 11.5 mm Hg systolic and 8.9 mm Hg diastolic.Someone alert Sally Fallon Morell or Stephanie Seneff. There has GOT to be a saturated fat deficiency thing going on here!!
The selection of food for the program consisted of foods available in Hawaii before Western contact, such as taro (a starchy root-like potatoes), poi (a mashed form of taro), sweet potato, yams, breadfruit, greens (fern shoots and leaves of taro, sweet potato, and yams), fruit, seaweed, fish, and chicken. All foods were served either raw or steamed in a manner that approximated ancient styles of cooking.But surely these poor folks were starving on less than 1600 cal/day! Nope ...
Unlimited quantities of foods except fish and chicken were made available. To approximate the diet of the ancient Hawaiians, which was estimated to contain less than 10% fat, the amounts of fish and chicken were limited to a total of 142-198 g/d. The participants were required to come to the meal site twice a day. In the morning breakfast was eaten as a group. Lunch and snacks were distributed at this time. In the evening everyone met for a cultural or health-education session during dinner. Each day these participants were asked if they were hungry by use of a hunger-satiety scale described by Haber; if they were not satisfied, they were encouraged to eat more and to take enough snacks so that they would be fully satisfied.As to carbs and diabetes?
Interestingly, in just 3 weeks, these subjects lost 17 lbs and saw improvements in everything ... despite consuming over 300 g carb both before and after the intervention, and although cutting around 20g carb went from roughly 50% to almost 80% of their diet. Since Shanahan mentions fasting glucose over 90 as an early sign of trouble (Doc heal thy host ;-) ) the average in this study dropped from 8.99 mmol/L (162 mg/dL) to 6.86 mmol/L (123 mg/dL) ... ahem paging Fred Hahn! I will be blogging on the rather exceptional results of this study in a separate post.
If the Hawaiian women Shanahan came in contact with while doctoring there were healthy, etc. due to consuming a traditional diet, it was not anything resembling her version of WAPF-paleo-deep-in-the-woo-woods nutrition. Remember, she was studying the culinary habits of her healthiest patients. Ethnobotany!
So Shanahan takes her place to the right of Gary Taubes for misrepresenting her pet culture. I don't know, haven't seen much new or watched it from Taubes. Does he still trot out poor "Fat Louisa" and misrepresent the Pima? While I'm on this topic, I'm not sure exactly where to seat Paul Jaminet and claims he makes about Perfect Health Diet and traditional cultures. In Chapter 25 the headline quote is:
The Perfect Health Diet closely resembles traditional diets of the Pacific Islands, whose inhabitants were noted for their exceptional health and beauty.Of the Hawaiian diet he writes:
The traditional diet of the native Hawaiian consisted of taro (often prepared as poi), sweet potatoes, breadfruit, coconut, fish, squid, shellfish, pork, fowl including chicken, taro leaves, seaweed and limu (algae), and a few sweet fruits.
A famous festival hosted by King Kamehameha III in 1847 served “271 hogs, 482 large calabashes of poi, 602 chickens, 3 whole oxen, 2 barrels salt pork, 2 barrels biscuit, 3,125 salt fish, 1,820 fresh fish, 12 barrels lu’au and cabbages, 4 barrels onions, 80 bunches bananas , 55 pineapples, 10 barrels potatoes, 55 ducks, 82 turkeys, 2,245 coconuts, 4,000 heads of taro, 180 squid, oranges, limes, grapes and various fruits.” (8) Except for the biscuits— hardly a food that would have been available seventy years earlier— these are all foods we can highly recommend. As this menu suggests, most calories came from meat, fish, taro, and coconut. (Perfect Health Diet - Kindle Locations 4521-4528)The edicts in PHD are very specific as regards carbohydrates, as well as his carefully laid out (though flawed on both logical and evidenciary bases) rationale for high (60+%) fat content. While Paul recommends 100g starch per day, he cautions against too much more than that -- a caution for which he unfortunately fails to provide any evidence. Not only does he misrepresent the Thai diet in the book, but he makes no effort to reference the usual dietary patterns of Hawaii. A famous festival? I mean on Christmas Eve we eat 12 dishes, all vegetarian but for two fish selections. On Thanksgiving I serve potatoes, wild rice, sweet potatoes and stuffing, turkey and either lamb, ham or a beef roast of some sort, and at least two types of pies are served for dessert. What does that have to do with what we actually eat on a regular basis? I would add that this comes after a discussion of the Okinawan diet which he selectively references as being described as greasy! (I have an interesting paper on this to blog on in the future as well. Their diet is not meat-based low carb.) After all of this, the section is tied up with:
Takeaway
We did not know when we began writing that we would be recommending the foods traditionally eaten by Pacific Islanders. We are reassured that the Perfect Health Diet, which we arrived at from our study of the scientific literature, is very similar to traditional diets known to produce superb health.Too bad that study of the literature didn't include more on the usual traditional diets or go past the types of foods to how much of each. I may well have missed it as well, but one simply cannot make rice based dishes on the PHD and I've yet to see much (not saying there isn't any, but much) in the way of meals involving taro or WHOLE coconut. Has there been a paleo that eats coconuts by the way? Or do they just save those for the chickens? Nowadays you can get fresh coconuts year round at economical prices. I never see a few chunks on the pages of the cook books in actual dishes!
In Conclusion ....
I just had to rant a little because I am sick of this being repeated over and over to where people parrot it about the internet as truth. If you are going to point to an ancestral diet for guidance, then point to it accurately and fully. You don't get to use parts of the diet (like specific foods that might be consumed) and rearrange the proportions or preparations to suit promoting your diet or guidelines.
I'm also sick of so-called experts in diabetes furthering the misinformation that carbohydrates cause diabetes and low carb is the one and only way to go with that. Carbohydrates -- to the tune of 70-80% -- did not cause diabetes in the traditional Pima nor the native Hawaiians. These two groups just happen to be "poster cultures" for modern diets gone wrong suffering high rates of diabetes and obesity as Western influence has changed their diets. These cultures simply did NOT get fat and sick by trading a traditional high fat diet off for a high carb one.
If folks like Shanahan and Cate, and all the rest of those enthralled by "ancestral" populations, believe in evolution and adaptation and turning on and off genes and whatnot, they would not be recommending their LCHF diets for these populations or anyone else.
I'm also sick of so-called experts in diabetes furthering the misinformation that carbohydrates cause diabetes and low carb is the one and only way to go with that. Carbohydrates -- to the tune of 70-80% -- did not cause diabetes in the traditional Pima nor the native Hawaiians. These two groups just happen to be "poster cultures" for modern diets gone wrong suffering high rates of diabetes and obesity as Western influence has changed their diets. These cultures simply did NOT get fat and sick by trading a traditional high fat diet off for a high carb one.
If folks like Shanahan and Cate, and all the rest of those enthralled by "ancestral" populations, believe in evolution and adaptation and turning on and off genes and whatnot, they would not be recommending their LCHF diets for these populations or anyone else.
Comments
"Long nose" :) So an overwhelming majority of Chinese would be unhealthy as they would not meet this criterion :)
Regards,
Rad
Namesake Weston Price, the dentist who wandered the world in the early 20th century assessing people's health and diet by peering into their mouths (and whose book WAPFers cherrypick and ignore as it suits them) frequently described the people he studied in this manner. He appears to have been part of the then-trendy discipline of anthropometry (human measurement). Today anthropologists and archaeologists tend to find such descriptions and methods deeply creepy because of their associations with eugenics and so-called "scientific racism". See Stephen Jay Gould's "The Mismeasure of Man" for a discussion of anthropometry in historical context.
Hey, it's paleo- must be a "dog digderidoo"
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:jgT9JGHAlwAJ:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dog-whistle_politics+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca&client=firefox-a
Although, to be completely honest, there are Polynesian cultures that eat high-fat diets. Just not Kitavans, Okinawans, or Hawaiians.
In my opinion, the worst kind of misappropriation is when the paleos go out and say "the Plains Indians ate lots of red meat, so we should too." The subtext being: "I don't actually want to engage with real Indians of the sort that are actually around today. I'd rather entertain fantasies about a Paleolithic time when everything was perfect."
This whole Paleo thing is basically nineteenth-century-style noble savage worship except with the racist connotiations more deeply buried.
to be morally, intellectually and physically superior to Westerners.
The Eugenics movement was primarily concerned with culling "defective"
people of European origin. It was not about eliminating tribal people. [eg KKK leader David Duke has publicly supported the rights of Australian
Aborigines for many years.]
The average urban Westerner 100 years
ago was a pitiful physical specimen, malnourished and disease ridden.
10% of men had syphilis, TB was rampant. Many people were crippled by
polio and rheumatic fever. Dentistry mostly consisted of pulling out the
(many) rotten teeth of sufferers.
During WW1 and WW2 about 1/4 of men failed their medical examinations for military service (despite very entry low standards).
http://www.goldennumber.net/beauty/
RIght now this is featured on her blog:
http://drcate.com/the-flat-belly-code/
And she seems to like to scrutinize celeb siblings to "prove" her second sibling theory vis a vis beauty http://drcate.com/?s=siblings
Strange.
Their festivals probably included fatty festival foods. But the reason the island was known for their pork was because that's the animal they butchered during the festival. When you look at the annual consumption of pork compared to the japanese they did surpass them, but only in the tune of 30g a day, mixed in with their starches and whatever other foods they consisted off
Paul Jaminet trying to claim that these festival diets validates his diet is almost comical. I'm assuming the crossed the deadly 30% carbohydrate margin by quite and extent when they were eating their day-to-day diet.
Eugenics will remain at its fundamentals and cultural eros, a self-indulgent, unscientific pursuit of grandiosity, pathetically dolled up to conceal the blood stains of ignorance and bigotry.
At least the baseless caveman speculation can be humoured for a few minutes before dismissal, but outright misrepresenting a rather recent aspect of reality really does take the game to a whole new level. It's Taubes' Pima example all over again.
No wonder she'd fall for the folly of Fibonacci. What people don't understand is that doctors, unless they work in specialized fields, can be as clueless about cholesterol as lay people. They're clinicians; biochemistry was back in college. The website shows that she lists her specialty as "Nutritional Support," "Sports Medicine," and "Weight Loss." I don't see "lipidology" nor "hypothyroidism" anywhere, even though she's been rather voluble of late regarding these topics. She accepts 13 insurance plans, including Medicare and Medicaid. That is pretty aggressive, even for a GP, even in the age of conveyor belt medicine.
http://www.healthgrades.com/physician/dr-catherine-shanahan-x3nq2/appointment#AppointmentsAndOffices2_anchor
A mindset like that naturally falls for Fibonacci, bubbles, get rich quick schemes, UFO abductions, lake monsters, and low-carbing for longevity.
The younger generations are eating more white rice like the rest of Japan and more "American" food. Therefore, the life expectancy figures on Okinawa is dropping precipitously as younger people die before their elders do.
One could appreciate the commitment individuals like her show towards low carb, if only it didn't involve revisionist nonsense, which seems to have become a common theme these days. Stick to the science and supporting evidence and stop co-opting other, contrary stuff, into the narrative because that'll just hurt the credibility of the case being made.
Aren't Dingos neolithic to Australia?
I have ZERO psychology background - out of curiosity, is there a personality type that needs to "push output" and is highly resistant to feedback?
In my psych ignorance credibility is a complete non-issue for this profile; it's all about the pushing.
Anecdotally and IMHO the math woo force is strong with these ones.
I fell for this one for a short while as part of a China study revulsion, but I must admit I was predisposed to the message at the time.
I am sick of the way Asian/ Pacific Islander diets have been distorted then deliberately misrepresented to further push paleo agendas. Okinawan/ Japanese diets in early half of the 20th century which was responsible for healthy longevity, was definitely not animal protein-heavy. My grandparents ate that way most of their lives, so I know what I'm talking about. Yes pork was the preferred animal protein but it was second to fish. Even then, both sources of protein were consumed sparingly and certainly not as main dish, they were used one of multiple ingredients (mainly plant-based) that went into a dish. I lived with my grandparents for about a year when I was six years-old. A typical day's meals would be like this: Breakfast- rice or rice porridge, pickled vegetables, leftover soup or vegetable dish from last night's dinner, seasoned dried anchovies, fermented tofu cubes, maybe occasionally a fried egg from our kept hens if we didn't have leftover dish from dinner or anchovies. Lunch: sautéed green vegetables or goya sutéed with some sort of mushrooms, root vegetables, and tofu, rice or noodles in broth and more veggies, followed by assortment of fruits on a plate, for example orange slices, pear slices, mango wedges, you get the idea. Dinner: fish as the main dish served at the center of the table, if not fish then usually a stewed pork dish which my grandmother cooks a pot of (to be eaten over the next few days) and the serving for each person was not big at all, maybe half of what is considered one serving of meat (3ounces?) here today, a vegetable soup, a sautéed vegetable dish with tofu or yuba, and finally more sliced assortment of fruits after dinner. In between meals I was given snacks of more fruits and sometimes other snacks which my grandparents did not partake in. Though sometimes when the sweet potatoes peddler passed by the house, my grandmother would give me money to buy a couple for all of us to snack on.
They drank tea throughout the day, even ending it with tea when neighbors dropped by in the evening after dinner to watch tv and discuss issues of the day together. My grandmother died at age 92 and my grandfather at age 98. Aside from healthy diet, they both arose early and were physically active, either doing daily calisthenics in the courtyard or tending the vegetable and fruit gardens, sometimes these activities were supplemented by an after dinner walk if the sun was still out.
We ate what was available. I ate calves brains mixed with scrambled eggs, blood sausage, head cheese, beef kidneys, beef heart, pork ribs and cabbage that cooked all day and stunk up the house. Fried chicken every, EVERY Sunday. If we were lucky we had peach or apple cobbler. Bread and gravy was like a desert served at the end of the meal.
I remember there was a 1 gallon can that had crystallized honey in it, once in a while you would just go take a big spoonful, no worries, no thinking about calories, no obsession, no one telling you you couldn't have any.
Looking back I realize now we were eating on the cheap, I mean calves brains mixed with eggs, really?
Isn't it amazing.
Cheers
it's way worse than simple denial.
the militant low carb branch of the paleo movement is leveraging various tools of persuasion to convince people if the diet gets them in trouble they need to GO HARDER.
(Just an aside: Clinton may be vegan but he eats salmon once a week. Still, a vegan except for that one meal.)
Paleo community have been taken over by dogmatic people who cling onto paleo dictates in a way not unlike religious fervor. Case in point, getting mad at someone like me who admitted to eating tofu. Me, even though I don't eat meat, I have no problem with others who eat meat, because I'm a reasonable person who doesn't use restrictive, dietary lifestyle to preach to and deride others for not joining in their superior religion.
Then, when they start VLCing for a long time, they end up with dysregulated cortisol like Jimmy Moore, which tends to raise BG. No one told them that VLCing wrecked their hormones and diabetes could result from untreated cortisol dysregulation. This is taken as a sign that they must increase the fat, lower protein, courtesy of Nora Gedgaudaus. I've seen a few actually that ended up with Cushing's and subsequently became diabetic. If only these people knew just how badly they've wrecked their hormones and immune system.
particle size? That's when you realize these GPs know even less than
Jimmy.'
You may be surprised to know that in most countries these tests are considered to be worthless and not even offered by pathology laboratories. Leading cardiologists (except in the US) are far more interested in your blood pressure and weight than any lipid subfractions.
Here's the other thing that I just put my finger on -- Mr. Greasy Okinawans, Paul Jaminet is no advocate of the pig!
http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2012/02/pork-did-leviticus-117-have-it-right/
http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2012/02/the-trouble-with-pork-part-2/
SIGH.
On paper what I described looks like a lot of soy. But I should explain more in detail. The fermented tofu, one serving of that is like maybe 1/2 to 1 inch square because it's rather salty, that's why it's considered a condiment. The tofu is usually the firm variety, so it lends itself well to cooking methods like sautéing and braising. So tofu is not served like it is here as a big chunk of grilled something or as ersatz meat substitute. Rather, tofu is cubed, sliced, mashed, etc....to be used as one of the ingredients in a dish. Though sometimes it is not rare to sit down to enjoy a small block serving of fresh tofu Japanese style, that is cold and seasoned with citrus sauce and sliced ginger or green onions. The yuba, or tofu skin, again is sliced into strips for sautées. People didn't eat ginormous amounts of it just as they didn't eat ginormous amounts of meat. I would guess the older folks ate about one serving of soy everyday, many ate two servings a day from what I gather then and now, especially the oldest of the old folks, but I think personally it's just due to the really old folks losing their teeth so meat becomes harder to chew.
Okinawans, Japanese, and Chinese have been eating tofu, yuba, fermented soy foods since ancient times. When my relatives came here to visit, in the 90s when Boca burger and other ISP ersatz meat foods were all the rage here among vegetarians, they were all grossed out by that stuff. I never cared for that junk either. Believe me, when you have tasted traditional, freshly made tofu, soy milk, or yuba, you will not eat those junk soy products.
From my experiences in Japan, people there eat a lot more soy foods (but still whole soy foods not ISP) than the Okinawans. Fruit is very expensive in Japan so people eat more veggies than fruit there. In Okinawa the fruit prices are not as high as they are in mainland Japan so Okinawans enjoy more fruits than their mainland counterparts. So within greater Japan there are differences which account for longevity.
It's interesting that soy was historically used in LC products for decades ... likely ISP in many/most ... and yet people lost weight and hailed the glories of low carb nonetheless. IOW, things blamed on soy these days by the paleo low carbers or is that the low carbers gone paleo simply lack credibility.
I am curious ... what is your experience with the shirataki or konjac noodles? I used to get them when I was LC and found limited uses for them. I find it odd how something that requires Ca(OH)2 to even exist. Further these have zero nutritional value (perfect for low anything dieters) . Our Asian markets carry huge varieties of these noodles but I have NEVER seen anyone actually perusing the case let alone buying the stuff. Are they really eaten in Japan?
Is the tofu one buys at a grocery store near as good as the "real" stuff? I found when I've tried it that it sits like a lump in my stomach. I'm wondering like Ev about the noodles
Thank you so much
When it comes to PHD, I think the authors do argue that the diet is a fusion of the positive aspects of various diets and that its blueprint cannot be centred around any one culture, hence the 'perfect' in the title. Meaning that the Okinawan concept (Revisionist Edition), only supports his idea to an extent, but then he gets the rest of it right where those poor saps were so woefully wrong. This then raises the question: Aside from being a more moderate form of a low-carb diet, what is so special and certain about this dietary mantra?
One can't just pick and chose sections of various successful cultures without properly explaining away other aspects that have been excluded. For example (and this is just my example): taking selective sections of the Okinawan diet and then fusing it with a very high fat intake on grounds that another culture, such as the Scandinavians, ate a lot of fat and did okay, is some serious reaching. The often infatuated Swede example of fat intake also raises its own questions since the country's overall economic standing, opulence--even through the second world war--and quality of life play a serious confounding role in the equation. They're definitely doing okay for a variety of other reasons that even some of the developed countries would consider a luxury and I would be curious to see how well this pans out long term since they have had a rising lipid rate and BMI in recent times.
At this point, one is just rationalising away the gaping holes in their own thesis and this eventually transforms solid, firm notions into vague and often meaningless metaphors that lack any substance or distinctive features that merit their unique place in the market of ideas.
I always tell my friends when they ask me, to follow the actual research studies, if they don't have a background in science, I link them the abstracts of studies or tell them to look up abstracts of cited studies. Get comfortable in discerning between hype, flawed/ misleading studies and what is considered good science/ solid research. One really does not need to have a science background to do just that, one only needs some further self-education in basic research protocol, it comes in handy when bombarded with headline hypes or scaremongering be it from bloggers or news sources.
Back to soy, let's step back and appreciate the fact that soy has been part of the staple diet in Asia especially China and Japan since ancient times. In Japan especially so, since meat-eating was considered taboo until fairly recent history. Thus in Japan they have a history of soy food culture where nothing is wasted in making soy products. For example in making tofu, you get byproduct soy milk then from soy milk you get yuba skin. Afterwards the ground soybean mush can be eaten and in fact it is used in many appetizer dishes. Then there are fermented soy foods which are interesting as well. In Japan, often tofu is one of the first foods a baby learns to eat. We drank soy milk on regular basis too. Now that is not to say soy milk should be substituted for babies, not at all. The problem I see is when a healthy food is "steroidized" as I like to call it, into the end all and be all. Individual nutrients are isolated from it or proteins isolated from it, to the point that it is no longer whole, healthy food. It doesn't help matters when headline-grabbing study about dangers of soy causing cancer grabs our attention.
For instance there was a study saying just that, according to paleo people. But then when you read the research, you realize that it was genistein, an isolated component of soy, which was extracted and given in huge amounts to laboratory mice. Well duh, of course they grew tumors! What if I isolated carnitine from meat, fed to mice in large amounts over a period of time, would I expect them to grow tumors? I would hypothesize yes to that. So you see, that is just one example of overreaching and deceptive science. If eating soy was so awful on health, we would see Japan as the most unhealthy nation in the world, with babies and children developing mental/ cognitive dysfunctions, men walking around with moobs, and cancer rates skyrocketing, to name just a few things attributed to soy dangers.
A lot of the time we in the West tend to view things in terms of more is better. Eating 1-2 servings of soy a day is fine, but eating 5-6 or more a day or in isolated forms of soy protein I think is unwise not to mention uninteresting for one's diet. I also think that a lot of the anti-soy sentiment is a pushback against those disgusting ISP products being promoted as healthy food which it certainly is not. In that regard the debate has been good, but it's sad that the truth got lost and the real issues got twisted and exploited by paleo propaganda.
If you have trouble with tofu "sitting in stomach" then maybe try firmer Nigiri type tofu? I cut firm tofu into small cubes and use it in curry, it is delicious because not only does it holds its shape but also absorbs the curry sauce. On the flip side I know someone who cannot digest firm tofu as well as softer (more water/ unpressed) variety. Another way I use firm Nigiri tofu is I slice one serving (a small thin square block) of it, sautée with celery, green leafy veggie, garlic, and carrots, so good with rice or just on its own.
I find this to be quite funny, this is on soy research.
http://www.bonappetit.com/entertaining-style/trends-news/article/tofu-what-does-science-say
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20378106
About shirataki noodles or konnyaku blocks that I see both in Asian grocery stores and in regular supermarkets here, that's a very interesting question. There are some shirataki noodles here that are made from tofu and konjac, but I'm assuming you mean the original kind of shirataki noodles made from konjac plant? In Japan there are many more varieties of konnyaku, many of them regional takes on the same theme, like different flavorings added or different textures. Yes people do eat konnyaku in Japan but more often they buy the block form and slice them to be used in dishes. Konnyaku is best that way in my opinion, in stews where it can soak up the flavoring of the stew. Stir frying it is another popular option, though you almost have to
I was going to say stir frying you almost have to over-season a bit because konnyaku unlike tofu, does not soak up flavors as quickly. Also in Japan many foods are not eaten simply for taste but for the texture. Konnyaku is one of those foods. To Westerners it is bouncy, jelly-like yet firm. It kind of goes with the Japanese taste for bouncy (best I can describe it) mouthfeel, and why they love to use agar-agar in desserts and sweets.
Keep in mind though that this was authored by a vegetarian with obvious conflicts:
"M.M. regularly consults for companies that manufacture and/or sell soyfoods and/or isoflavone supplements, and he is the executive director of the Soy Nutrition Institute, a science-based organization that is funded in part by the soy industry and the United Soybean Board."
Others are more cautious -
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19919579
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3074428/
Think about any service provider monitored by the Better Business Bureau. You have a few rats running around your house so you call an exterminator. Instead of using conventional rat poison, the exterminator uses his patented poison mix called VLC, which he claims works 100% better than competition. You see that the rats are gone. But a few months later, you find out that you've been invaded by termites because the poison called VLC chemically attracts another type of pest; soon your foundation is giving way and your house is ruined.
If something like this happened, not only would you call BBB or the Board of Health, the District Attorney's office or hire an attorney for fraud. That's the situation here. Unfortunately, some of these gurus are doctors are very glib and clever at hiding the underside of VLCing. They'll recycle customers, who'll rave about weight loss initially. Many are medically illiterate so they will shrug off cold hands, low body temperature and other signs of hormonal dysfunction. It's the ones that stick with it long-term like diabetics who end up with permanent damage. Michael Edes is very clever playing dumb and playing to the uninitiated converts whenever charges of side effects are leveled against him. Fraud is not a strong charge to level against these guys. If enough people focused and did something, they can and will bankrupt these charlatans.
The links you have provided tell of caution for infant soy formulas and raised unanswered questions about hormone disruptors, which were not addressed by the study. Most of the scaremongering by bloggers and quack physicians take such questions posed and then turn these questions into statements or facts. Again, soy is one of the most studied foods today, data from studies focusing on individual components of soy are often misrepresented by anti-soy paleo community. Same thing with misrepresenting soy as superfood by vegans.
The Japanese eat a lot of soy, by a lot I mean probably around 1-2 servings a day on average, everyone eats soy from babies to the elderly. Between China, Korea, and Japan which all have soy as regular part of diet, I'd say the Japanese eat the most of it. Soy has been part of Japanese and Chinese diets for at least the past millenium+. If soy was as harmful as it is made to be in the West amongst certain militant paleo crowd, we would see the health side effects there. I personally am sick of traditional/ ancestral Asian food cultures being misappropriated and cherry-picked to fit paleo agendas.
It depends. In the case of Messina, given his vegetarian agenda and strong ties to the soy industry, extra skepticism of anything he writes is needed. His job is essentially a soy promoter which he has been doing for more than 20 years. I just brought up his ties because people who cite this paper are often quick to point out potential conflicts in papers they disagree with but then ignore the blatant conflicts in the Messina paper. However, it seems that this does not apply to you.
Anyway, agreed with much of what you had to say.
Fear and the learning curve involved in grasping new concepts, and their potential conflict with the views you currently hold dear are behind such intransigence. Even if Shanahan was bright enough the grasp LDL-P, she would still have a problem since it could mean low trigs could induce atherosclerosis -- a no no, if you're devoted to low-carbing and keeping trigs low. These are differing motivations behind not embracing the latest technology. In the case you mention, it's cost and unavailability. In her case, it's fear and sheer ignorance.
It is filled with total nonsense in 3/4 of it. Including such things as exploding HDL and fat cells that pack up shop and move to become muscle cells and vice versa throughout your body.
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