las

Welcome all seeking refuge from low carb dogma!

“To kill an error is as good a service as, and sometimes even better than, the establishing of a new truth or fact”
~ Charles Darwin (it's evolutionary baybeee!)

Thursday, April 2, 2015

Jimmy Moore ~ Low Carb Asset or Liability?

Another timely bump.  Note that this is almost one year after original publication.  In response mostly to this post, Jimmy wrote:  Who Knew Eating Butter Would Be So Controversial?   Seriously?  There's a difference between eating a pat of butter here and there, and putting a half pound on a plate with some eggs and calling that a meal.  
A few weeks ago, I attended the annual Paleof(x) conference in Austin, Texas and it was such a fantastic experience for everyone in the Paleo, primal, low-carb, real food community. Getting to meet so many people who shared their stories about how the work I am doing is changing their lives is incredibly gratifying and makes me appreciate the unique opportunities that this platform affords me. And while it was a positive experience attending this amazing event, the fact is it was also pretty stressful. It’s happy stress, but stress nonetheless. Plus, as you’ve know I’ve been hunkered down banging out my book on ketogenic diets which entails yet another layer of stress all to its own. Isn’t it ironic that the process of writing a book about health could be so unhealthy? Ahhhh, but I’m not complaining because the end result will be so worth all the effort it took to get there. You’ll see.
With the rise in cortisol as of late, it has taken a toll on my ketones (under 1.0 mmol), blood sugar (hovering around 100), and weight (up ~20 pounds since January). I’m not worried about these things because I recognize what’s going on. Once the editing process of Keto Clarity is finished in the next couple of months, I’ll be able to devote time to recovering and getting all of these numbers back in line again.
Note the bolded play of the Martyr Card.  Cortisol.  Damned that hormone and its magical fat hoarding abilities!   


It's like deja vu, all over again ...






Original Publish Date 4/20/14


Ahh Jimmy Moore.  


Nobody's going to say it, so I might as well start the conversation on the fact that Jimmy's "nutritional ketosis" regime has stopped working for him.   His appearance at PaleoFX New Age CONference and MLM Expo was surely shocking to some.  It shouldn't have been.  This is Jimmy Moore we're talking about and this is nothing new.  More on that in a bit, but first, how about that picture there on the right.  So proud is Jimmy that he made this his profile picture on Twitter and Facebook.  



My own personal ketogenic rehabilitation plan: 5 local pastured eggs cooked in salted Kerrygold grassfed butter with garlic spices and a whole stick of unsalted Kerrygold grassfed butter.

After returning from last week's Paleo(f)x conference travel from South Carolina to Austin, Texas, my ketones and blood sugar have been going wacky on me. So to help get things back in line again, this is a great go-to meal to push ketone levels higher, blood sugar levels lower. If you're ever struggling with ketone production, try this and see how you do.
Jimmy went on to claim that he's so carb sensitive even leafy greens need to be limited.   This will be Gary Taubes' lasting legacy from GCBC for Dummies, aka Why We Get Fat.  If Jimmy replaced half of that block of butter with an equal amount of calories in not only leafy greens but even a potato or two, he'd be far better off.

For anyone not familiar with Kerrygold, that's an 8 ounce block there = 1 cup of butter.  To go with butter to cook 5 eggs in.  I'm not going to bother with the fancy nutritional break down here, but this meal is roughly 35 grams of protein and a whopping 180g fat.  In one sitting.   This is NOT healthy.  For anyone.  NOBODY in the history of mankind has ever considered a block of butter a meal.  This is beyond insane.  AND HE IS ENCOURAGING OTHERS TO FOLLOW HIS LEAD.

Later in the same day as posting this, Jimmy had this exchange on Twitter:


Yes folks, butter is gathered!   This would be humorous if it weren't so sad and so many still follow this guy's lead.   I don't know what Victory Belt is thinking giving this guy a second book deal, but that he is any sort of leader or mouthpiece for the low carb and paleo communities is a joke.  Worse than Fat Head comedy routine fare at that.

I got in trouble for "persecuting" members of the low carb community when I began calling them out with my Is LC morphing into HAES series.   I stand by that series, and no, no matter how much know-nothings repeat misrepresentations of what I say, I was not mocking ANYONE for their weight. 

Read any LC diet book, beginning with Atkins, and there is the same promise of effortless weight loss consuming tons of food.  It's the insulin stupid!  But these gurus all ran into the same problem everyone else has:  weight is difficult to lose when you have a lot of it to lose, and if you succeed at losing it, it is even more difficult to maintain.  I get that.  I've lived that.  But the low carb community on the whole are poor ambassadors for their "way of eating".  This is when weight loss morphed into "I'm doing this for my health" and *healthy* got attached to low carb all over the place.  
Q:  Why do you care about Jimmy's weight you middle aged woman, you?  (paraphrased from marksuave recent comments here).
A:  I don't.  I care about others who might follow his lead.  I care about their health and that they are making the best choices for themselves based on the facts as we know them, not as folks like Jimmy twist them.
When you read, look, listen and learn from the LC gurus, the health picture is pretty dismal indeed.  Jimmy has been using phrases such as "I'm doing keto for my health not weight loss" since last Fall.  Translation:  "I'm gaining weight again".  In 2012, weighing close to 300 lbs, Jimmy told Abel James he was the healthiest he's ever been.  A year later, as he dipped below the 250 pound mark, readers were treated to a litany of health problems he was suffering that ketosis had resolved.   

Lately he's taken to using the word *thriving* to describe his life on beta hydroxybutyrate.  

Why when I read that does the image of this guy keep popping into my head?

Now I am sorry to point this out, but in most studies involving weight loss on a reasonable low carb diet, metabolic markers do tend to improve.  Not all of them, however, and that cannot be ignored.  But Jimmy Moore may well be the first person to ever lose 80 lbs and see his LDL go up 80 points (or more).   His fasting blood sugars had been creeping into pre-diabetic range for years prior, he required berberine to bring them down.  (This, by the way on the backdrop of an ex low carber and a current one admitting to prediabetic and frank diabetic FBG levels recently).  

And yet ... There he was at PaleoFX last weekend moderating two panels.  One on how to piss off your mainstream doctor and waste thousands of dollars on functional medicine, and the other to clear up the cholesterol confusion only he seems to have.  (Pay no attention to that MLM banner ... run away!!)











Jimmy has taken to loaning out his soapbox -- aka the Livin la Vida Low Carb Show -- to all manner of chiropractors and "nutritionists" practicing medicine without a license on the internet.  This is his "relevance" at this point.  The low carb community gets mad -- boy do they ever -- when anyone points out the circus side show nature of it all.   "That's just Jimmy" pretty much doesn't cut it any more.  That's a dangerous man is what he is. 

So yesterday it was brought to my attention that one of my biggest fans, goes by the name of Eddie, is turning a bit on his friend.  It seems Eddie is not happy with Jimmy's butter stunt.  It makes a mockery of low carb.  Eddie doesn't like me too much because I expose the underbelly of his beloved community.  I also blog on the science here as regards what type 2 diabetes really is.  In his world view, there is only one way to go with that -- VLC and metformin.  It's a myopic view shared by many in the low carb community and they must prevent people from being exposed to folks like me who might show you otherwise through credible scientific references.   But anyway ...

He is upset with this stunt.  Hellooooooo?!!  Where have you been?  

  • 2007:  Jimmy gets to 248, goes on Kimkins, loses 35 or so pounds.  Generates a lot of publicity, rakes in a lot of money.  
  • 2010:  Jimmy gets to 280, goes on an eggfast -- nothing but eggs and coconut oil and butter for a month.  He reported a partial cholesterol profile at that time.  Not good.
  • 2011:  Jimmy gets to 290, goes on a beef, egg and CO "challenge" that quickly morphs to a BECO + chocolate diet.  
  • 2011:  After falling off that diet he fasts for 6 days and reaches his pre-KK weight of 248.  This sets him up to regain and he is up to 285 by year's end
  • 2012:  Jimmy tops 300 lbs and goes on "nutritional ketosis" experiment for one year.
See a pattern yet Eddie?  These are just the major extreme weight loss stunts.  Each time he has profited through affiliate sales and such as everyone marvels at the great weight loss magic.  I remember your comments on the stalker blog about how he would "show me" ... ummm ... show me what?  That he can lose weight?  He has shown the world that many times over.  He did it once with a low fat diet in 1999 losing 170 lbs then.  The only person Jimmy is impressing these days is the naive newbie or those who hope his shirt tails are long enough to garner them publicity and a chance at the internet prize$.

Have you seen this video? { EDIT 4/20 Awww, he removed the video.  No doubt because it shows him not only eating butter in a manner no normal person would, but because he did that while promoting Julian Bakery bread.  Julian Bakery now makes paleo breads and has co-re-branded as Paleo Inc.  Still very bad man and bakery to Jimmy Moore who hates that Paleo Magazine runs rull back-cover ads for Paleo bread and the like.  Oh oops!  Jimmy runs ads for Paleo Mag ... Awkward! }


Skip to around the 5 minute mark where he makes a "pizza" with *only* half a stick of butter on it.  2009 Eddie, 2009.  Jimmy has been struggling against self-made metabolic demons.  If his metabolism is broken, he did that, and it wasn't even the Little Debbies and Coke from his first 32 years to blame.  Perhaps you missed all the times -- when he allowed comments and discussions on his menus blog -- so many well meaning folks, myself included, encouraged him to moderate his approach, stabilize his weight, stop the "up the fat" and calorie denial that was sabotaging his efforts.  He didn't want any of it.  But you keep on calling me an awful human being when I call charlatans out on their games and do my best to present the full picture.  Remember, I came to this wanting to find reassurances about LC.  You can believe what you want from what others say, but that is the truth.

Good to have you on board calling out the damage he does to what remains of the legitimacy of low carb diets for diabetes and weight loss.  There is some.  It is not a silver bullet though, and there are options for some that LC dogma simply will not accept.  Why do you want to limit the information on which people make their health choices?   Rhetorical question.



EDIT #2 4/20:

I forgot to add something that came to my attention recently as well.  People who just come across Jimmy's sites, or catch him as a guest on a podcast, see him at an annual CONference, etc., generally have no idea what's really going on.  It is OK to struggle with weight.  It is not OK to be dishonest about it while personally vouching for products and services and profiting off of them.  In the past almost two years Jimmy has encouraged non-diabetic people to waste money on diabetic supplies and it showed in his yearly review of Amazon sales.  Even this tweet is about "rehabilitation" for his ketone levels, no mention that this has not been working for some time for his weight maintenance.  Even if he were 230, it would appear that those 230 lbs are increasingly "bad" -- as in less lean, more fat, and more concentrated abdominal obesity, a situation we can all agree (I hope) is associated with being less rather than more healthy.   But in articles and elsewhere, his ORIGINAL now almost 10 year old weight loss before/afters are still used.

Articles such as this one:  Ketogenic diet expert Jimmy Moore credits low-carb diet for 180-lb weight loss.  Granted it's an examiner.com article, but ...
... Moore, 42, said eating more fat not only helped him lose weight, but boosted his energy, eliminated nagging carb cravings, and improved his cholesterol profile. "Saturated fat actually raises your good cholesterol the best of all the foods you can eat," said Moore, who detailed his research in his books, Cholesterol Clarity and 21 Life Lessons From Livin' La Vida Low-Carb. ....
... Jimmy is a leader in the growing LCHF movement, which has been buoyed by recent medical reports touting the many health benefits of unprocessed saturated fat. Moore discusses the LCHF diet on his widely read blog, Livin' La Vida Low-Carb, and his popular weekly podcast.
Moore joins a long list of health and medical experts who agree that unprocessed saturated fat does not cause obesity, diabetes, or heart disease. ....
Expert?  Research?
'I Am Never Hungry'
Moore has had no trouble maintaining his 180-pound weight loss, and said he typically consumes about 20 grams of carbs a day. That may sound restrictive to some, but Moore insists his high-fat diet — which typically consists of eggs, avocados, bacon, sour cream, and full-fat cheese — satisfies him completely.
"Sometimes I actually forget to eat," he said. "It's freeing to not be burdened with the need to eat every three to four hours, like most people do."



428 comments:

1 – 200 of 428   Newer›   Newest»
MIchael Allen Smith said...

Love the word "charlatans". It perfectly describes so many of the leaders in the PALEO/LC community today.

Sanjeev Sharma said...

once one convinces themselves conservation laws are tautologous what other avenues remain?

Kevin Klatt said...

I've been stumbling across too many PhD's in nutrition who push low-carb lately (for reasons I can't exactly discern, besides the whole carbs = T2DM non-sense). Always good to come back to the asylum for some sanity :)

charles grashow said...

https://www.facebook.com/91566951319/photos/a.145604576319.138059.91566951319/10152425562031320/?type=1&stream_ref=10
About once every 24 hours is all I ever eat.

http://thelowcarbdiabetic.blogspot.com/2014/04/jimmy-moores-take-on-high-fat-diet.html

Post edit. A message via email from a well known and highly respected medical professional who asked to remain anonymous on this blog. Full name and address supplied.

"I follow Jimmy on Twitter, and yesterday he tweeted that he was eating five eggs cooked in Kerrygold butter with an additional stick of Kerrygold (8 oz, or roughly 240 grams), and that was it for the day. That's less than 40 grams of protein and over 200 grams of fat for the day. Jimmy is quite tall and needs at least twice that amount of protein at a minimum.

When someone asked him why he didn't include any spinach or other greens with the
eggs, he said that occasionally he eats greens but "I'm so carb sensitive that even greens can be problematic." This is nonsense, of course. And he doesn't even have diabetes!

His latest cholesterol profile is abominable; I know you use different values in the UK, but his LDL-C and LDL-P are extremely elevated and place him at very high risk for a cardiac event.

I'm so conflicted because on the one hand Jimmy has been a great advocate of the low-carb lifestyle and is friends with all of the major researchers in this area. But what he's promoting now is very irresponsible, in my opinion. I'm worried about his health and the perception that the non-low-carb community will have of us, since he's such a visible and vocal proponent of low carb.

Moderate protein, higher percentage of healthy fats, and lots of healthy vegetables. That is the way to follow low carb if you want to improve your health."

charles grashow said...

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=644230178959846&set=a.585995044783360.1073741829.311241758925358&type=1&theater

NS said...

Jimmy Moore is not the only one it seems who is apparently struggling on LC. I was surprised to see these recent images of K Altena, official Atkins sponsor, who, far more sanely than JM, wholly embraces regular exercise. In youtube comments, he explains that the weight gain is due to his recent inability to maintain his exercise regimen. So much for CICO criticism.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3lVA6E7v7k

John Smith said...

A whole stick of butter worked for Marlon Brando in "Last Tango In Paris," Jimmy is just getting his freak on.

He's a sex symbol, deal with it.

Jared0180 said...

It would be wonderful if Jimmy would seek professional physiological help with his eating disorder. I think if his income was not tied to low carbing, he wouldn't have carried it on this long. He could change his whole theme to Livin La Vida Healthy!

Hello_I_Love_You said...

Check out these comments by Fred Hahn on Jimmy's blog in response to a doc who tells Jimmy to get CAC and CIMT.

http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/jimmy-moores-cholesterol-test-results-2008-2013/18256

Jimmy says he has no health insurance. Fred Hahn, whose LDL ~ 180 (which means his TC could be north of 300) chimes in: "Why doc, what would that reveal?" Doc: "Young people often have zero CAC with a postive CIMT."

Doc is right but it's not just the young. The CAC doesn't really become meaningful until you turn 50. The calcium score starts soaring from 50. Fred can celebrate his zero CAC, but in his age group, say, between 40-50, the majority (55%) of the tested population does as well.

http://www.newportbodyscan.com/ebt-coronary-calcium-scoring-guide/

charles grashow said...

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1_Q5ek4ppElRY52aSAyn-8bCZHYxw8dmU17EtwcaU5WE/edit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBVC5N9sd-w

charles grashow said...

Jimmy Moore has taken a CIMT
http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/jimmy-moores-random-fall-2013-health-test-results/20619

Genevieve Evans said...

Thanks for posting this. It's not fat-shaming to point out that somebody who publishes a book proclaiming everybody is wrong about cholesterol and health is still markedly overweight after at least 5 years of pushing the low-carb dogma. (I get that sustainable weight loss is sometimes slower than we would like, and it's important not to starve yourself. But come on, after 5 years if you're still that obese on your "perfect" diet, something is obviously not working.) It's especially helpful when you point out his wide weight fluctuations and his habits of eating sticks of butter, which is indicative of an eating disorder. If somebody is only a casual listener of his show (as I used to be), they wouldn't see how this guy has been saying the same thing for years, and yet getting nowhere. It's sad on its own, but even worse when tells people this is the path to health.

Lighthouse Keeper said...

Eddie resides in the low carb foothills alongside cranks and nutritional hypochondriacs such as the "It's the wooo" blogger. From these environs he snipes and takes pot shots at registered dietitians and other medical professionals who do not conform to his fringe views.

NS said...

I don't understand why my comments always fail to appear. I enjoy your blog for reference. Can u shed light? thnx.

Glenn Dixon said...

Evelyn, what video?

charles grashow said...

The one that Jimmy removed

NS said...

OK, here goes another try.

JM is apparently not the only person struggling on a high-fat regimen. Atkins sponsored Ken Altena has been having issues as well. I was surprised to see these recent images of him; quite sad actually since KA wholly embraces and emphasizes regular exercise. In fact, in youtube comments, he cites the lack of exercise for his recent gain. So much for CICO criticism.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3lVA6E7v7k

Lighthouse Keeper said...

Gone but not forgotten.

Sanjeev Sharma said...

Jimmy Moore

Sanjeev Sharma said...

KY & Astroglide have too many carbs? Even the Atkins branded ones?

Sanjeev Sharma said...

> in his age group, say, between 40-50, the majority (55%) of the tested population does as well


some on the other forums seem to think zero CAC means absolute immunity from heart disease.

Sanjeev Sharma said...

FYI, disqus some comments that look like yours while it's loading comments but these disappear when that first view's replaced by the threaded one.

Sanjeev Sharma said...

> I don't understand why my comments always fail to appear.

I see this one- did you post this comment from a different-than-usual account?

Sanjeev Sharma said...

see my comment to Charles above; I saw this flash by for a few seconds but not in the regular view (ie, not visible now)

> Jimmy Moore is not the only one it seems who is apparently struggling on LC. I was surprised to see these recent images of K Altena, official

Hello_I_Love_You said...

Nope, calcium is only from hard plaque. You can have soft plaque build up and that could predispose you to ischemia and you could have a stroke. But zero CAC is the strongest predictor of not having heart attack in the next 5 years. But if you have other risk factors and zero CAC, and especaily if you're over 55, you're not immune. CIMT is for stroke. Both zero. Then your chances are low but not zero.

Bris Vegas said...

Jimmy is only 42. He looks closer to 70.

Hello_I_Love_You said...

This is from a UK-based diabetic group that follows Bernstein's diabetic diet. It is correct that 40g is too low for someone the size of Jimmy. And yes, he is irresponsible! Let's say that despite the very high LDL-C/P that his CIMT and CAC are zero/negative. That's for Jimmy. When you suggest that a 55 year old man with LDL-P in the 99th percentile is okay as long as his trigs are low, that's insane.

Charles, I see your comment there:

http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/6-month-lipid-panel-update-on-my-nutritional-ketosis-n1-experiment/16449

You asked him, "My blood work from October 2005 showed my lipid profile as nearly ideal with HDL at 71, triglycerides at 57, VLDL at 11, LDL at 119, and total cholesterol at an acceptable 201. This was what my numbers looked like after livin’ la vida low-carb for about 22 months and I was proud to see them doing so well." This i s not possible when you have reactively high cholesterol or perhaps Jimmy was on a high-carb Paleo diet, then. Jimmy is lying about these prior numbers or are these his pre-low carb numbers?

Hello_I_Love_You said...

Jimmy's TSH is now 3.7. He may not be euthyroid for long.

http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/jimmy-moores-random-fall-2013-health-test-results/20619

Bris Vegas said...

CAC scans are useless. The American association of Family Physicians is opposed to their use.
http://www.aafp.org/afp/2012/0901/p405.html

The official Australian medical guidelines state that doctors should not refer patients for CAC scans. Australian radiology centres are also advised not to offer CAC scans.

Bris Vegas said...

The Masai (Mann 1970) had extensive calcification of their coronary arteries by middle age but no evidence of infarcts.

Kade Storm A.K.A. Hedonist said...

He wasn't doing ketogenic dieting in the manner that he's doing now. It was a much more whole foods-oriented, protein rich diet with even fruits being part of intake.

Also, I think Evelyn pointed this out earlier, around the time of those 2005 results, he had only recently quit lipid-lowering drugs. So the result you see may have been the consequence of his pre-low carb days with medication.

Kade Storm A.K.A. Hedonist said...

Not according to what's been published and it's even addressed in the comments section. He didn't get the actual CIMT test due to not being insured.

Kade Storm A.K.A. Hedonist said...

Heh. Echo chambers are a fun place.

Hello_I_Love_You said...

Here's a comment from that site:

"My guess the big part of Jimmy's problem is the particular hormonal balance after a massive weight loss. What sort of a medical attention such people normally receive besides the advice to eat less and move more? People in such condition do not receive an adequate help and manage the best way they can, often on their own. For example, Wooo reported, that according to her experience, leptine injections completely stopped her body from regaining weight after a big weight loss. I am sure it wouldn't help everyone, but others like her could be possibly helped and would be like insulin-dependent diabetics living with daily injections."

That's correct and the hormonal imbalance is coming from leptin deficiency; before, he had excess leptin. When you go into a leptin deficient state, your dysregulate your hormones and the immune function. The hallmark is falling WBCs, globulins and low T4 and high T8. He's probably immune-deficient at this stage. Woo may have fixed those problems with leptin injection, which is emerging as a treatment for immunodeficiency. Leptin is a two-faced beast. Rosedale and Kruse jumped on it and thought it only had to do with satiety and tried to lower it; however, leptin modulates immune and hormonal homeostases. Going from excess to deficit, it will screw up your system you eventually will need to go on bioidentical hormones or leptin injection therapy.

Bris Vegas said...

There is no tautology because animals, including humans, are far more than a collection of metabolic pathways.

Complex biological processes cannot be reduced to simplistic notions such as CICO.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/science-reveals-why-calorie-counts-are-all-wrong/

Kade Storm A.K.A. Hedonist said...

Is this that video where he's trying to be a real hotshot about consuming massive amounts of cheese with his pizza-like concoction? There was even some lame-tard joke dropped about how Dean Ornish would have a heart attack from just watching the video. What a hardcore rebel!

charles grashow said...

Remember that Jimmy was on a statin drug in 2004

http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/my-total-cholesterol-is-326-and-why-i-dont-need-to-take-lipitor-or-crestor-to-lower-it/2381

" When I decided to go on the Atkins diet in 2004, I was sick and
tired (literally!) of settling for the conventional wisdom for what
constituted a “healthy” diet and instead chose a way of eating that
would help me go on to shed 180 pounds. At the time when I still
weighed over 400 pounds, I was taking Crestor after a very painful stint
on Lipitor to control my “high cholesterol” which was around 250 at the
time. They had me so scared of NOT taking this statin that I felt like
it was my only option despite the agonizing pain these drugs have been shown to cause in more users than they even realize.Nine months later after losing about 140 pounds, I decided to come off of statin drugs for good."

So in 2005 when he had the blood work done it's possible that the blood test results were still being influenced by the statins (he doesn't say exactly when he quit the statins)

Notice the test results appx 5 months later

latest visit to the doctor in March 2006 and they have my doctor pulling out the dreaded "s" word yet again:

TOTAL CHOLESTEROL: 254
HDL: 72
LDL: 170
TRIGLYCERIDES: 44

I talked to my chiropractor, an opponent of statin drugs, about my
numbers and he said as long as my total cholesterol/HDL ratio is less
than 5:1 I should be fine. Using that scale, my ratio is about 3.5:1 so
I'm okay according to him.

http://livinlavidalocarb.blogspot.com/2006/03/cholesterol-conundrum-do-i-statin-or.html


Remember - his TC/HDL ratio is now appx 5.9:1 - SO what would his chiropractor say now??

Lighthouse Keeper said...

The "pizza" was noxious, worse than the sum of it's parts. One can only hope he never opens a pizza chain. Don't know why low carb / paleos or vegans bother trying to make pizzas, whatever is being used as an excuse for bread or cheese will sabotage it . There is a video of someone using the same piece of low carb bread to clean his kitchen and car, wringing it out in between.

carbsane said...

Hello all! Sorry for the comment glitches yesterday. I still have moderation "semi" on, so first time commenters usually got to moderation and comments with links (though not always for some reason??) often go to the mod queue as well. I think they're all published up now.


I was traveling/visiting all day yesterday and will be around and about all day today. Will respond if I get a chance, but in the mean time, thanks for contributing and carry on!!

carbsane said...

I think you have those numbers transposed ;-)

Sanjeev Sharma said...

I should have included some of the Jimkins stuff as shark jumping

carbsane said...

First: That is cauliflower with cheese sauce. CAULIFLOWER WITH CHEESE SAUCE. Gosh this drives me nuts sometimes.

Second: I'm sad to see Kent gaining. He had commented here a few times in the HAES series. I think he -- like many others -- are too touchy to grasp valid criticism. Atkins and LC schtick is all about how everyone else gets it wrong and how their approach is superior. Only it is not, and over the long run it would appear to be inferior in just about every measurable way.

Did he sustain an injury? I didn't see anything in comments. But this is the important thing. LC does not sustain exercise well. Not for performance anyway -- and even the non-competitive athlete generally gains motivation through personal bests and at least that "exercise high". After a while running on keto is a "high" but it is associated with a worse crash than insulin spikes. I have no science to back up this paragraph, just observation, some of it personal.


LC'ers often pride themselves on being sedentary (ahem, Fred Hahn!) and how exercise just makes you hungry. They go on and on (and on and on) about how they aren't ever hungry on LC. So then why do they ever eat anyway? How many times do we hear it is 80% diet?? If that is the case, Kent and so many others are prime examples of how that 80% ain't working for him. And no, "I'd be so much fatter if I ate carbs" doesn't cut it. He loves stunts. Lock Jimmy in a room with water, unlimited potatoes and leafy greens, and two pounds of butter for a month. Let's see how much fatter he comes out ....

Sanjeev Sharma said...

Does that surprise you? I don't find low carbers special in this.

Any one of these may be correct but some Vegan and whole grain pushers/propagandists make the most atrocious arguments(logical, scientific and skeptical) and pick the most cherries.

In addition to the PhDs studying in good faith all the fringe groups seem to have their share of PhDs that have downed the Kool-Ade, down to the "UFOlogists" and the Kennedy assassinologists.

carbsane said...

Yep

carbsane said...

Yes, he took it down. Finally. LOL. I've linked to it before and he didn't.


Recipe: 2 half inch slices of (no longer available) Julian Purity Bread (get your discount through Jimmy!!!)
Half a stick of butter - nuke to melt
Couple spoons of Classico no HFCS (Jimmy makes sure of that!) sauce
Handful of shredded mozz on each, extra bunch for good measure
Ton of Hormel mini pepperonis
Nuke some more ...


"Ooooooooh Christine!"

carbsane said...

Fixed I believe. Sorry about that!

charles grashow said...

This is what he posted

Wuchtamsel said...

Can't help, but this is so funny. :-p
This guy is like a (very easy) IQ-test on legs. If you listen to him, you didn't pass.

Wuchtamsel said...

The calcified parts of the plaques are actually much LESS prone to rupture, but their amount serves as a surrogate for the soft(!) plaques. This only gets useful after a certain age, when calcification sets in.


By the way, I bet my last € that the vasculature of Mr. M. is literally FULL of soft plaques by now.

carbsane said...

Interesting Twitter exchange brewing with author of the Examiner piece
https://twitter.com/CarbSane/status/457889347925049344

Wuchtamsel said...

To be perfectly honest I don't think she really cares. Those articles are not written with any amount of investigative mindset but are more or less pure entertainment.

Pedro said...

That does not look like your normal mean and ripped keto-adapted fat burning machine promoting paleo with some pseudo-scientific evolutionary BS. At least those guys are ripped as high carb bodybuilders...

Sanjeev Sharma said...

do you know of(please link to) any good skeptical coverage?

rudyInLA said...

If JM has deluded himself into believing his own rap, I feel sorry for him. If he's just flat out doing a job, I think he's a rat. I'll never know which it is, but I have my suspicions. From a health standpoint, he looks awful.

Lighthouse Keeper said...

The must seem like a dead end now for Jimmy Moore - he has check mated himself into a corner. His friend and close ally Tom Naughton has been taking a serious interest in resistant starch lately and the blogger who kickstarted the new resistant starch trend ( and stuck the boot into low carb dogma whilst attracting a lot of paleo interest ) is hosting an episode the LLVLC show on this subject soon. Jimmy Moore could be on the verge of making something of a change of tack here and there is quite some marketing potential in the gut biome field. Low carb tends to follow paleo around like a poodle and when a certain hang gliding anarcho-libertarian speaks paleo ears tend to prick up.

charles grashow said...

https://twitter.com/livinlowcarbman/status/457958222096113664/photo/1

Sanjeev Sharma said...

Sorry to add to the confusion. I assumed if disqus sent the data it was approved and there must be some other bug.

marksuave25 said...

A whole stick of butter? That's a little extreme. Also, I hope that you understand that my comments about you weren't in anger, so, hopefully none of your readers took your paraphrasing of me as me being angry. Back to Jimmy, I hope he keeps on trying to get to his goal weight. Now, Evelyn, you make it seem as if jimmy is making gobs and gobs of money from his low carb show. I would assume not, he says he doesn't health insurance, if he was making tons of money he would enroll in some form of insurance. I've never heard his reason for not having health insurance. Maybe I missed it. But many people here assume it's because of his cholesterol level.....I don't know, so I'm not going to assume why.

Susan said...

He eats a stick of butter? Ugh! How is that not an ED? I think his weight set point has been pushed higher and higher with each successive diet. I doubt he can ever get back to his lowest again. It's not the dieting, it's the maintaining --and for that you MUST eat fewer calories to maintain that lower weight. What's his highest? 400 lbs? Sad to say, but I think he stands a better chance of hitting that again than getting closer to his lowest weight.

t s said...

just saying hello.

Hello_I_Love_You said...

They fall into the same trap as regular people. But they can't change their positions as readily; their reputation will suffer since they've invested their time and energy to build a practice, protocols and a following. That's why they fail to evolve. Some of them are pushing 80, 85. People like Feynman, Bernstein, Phinney .. these guys are septa-octogenarians. These are the peers of Bob Atkins, who would be 84 if alive. When they jumped on the low-carb band wagon in the 1970s, pig/bovine insulin was being used. There was no HbA1c and no such thing as LDL-P or ANA or FT3.

carbsane said...

Oh poor Mark. I know you are not angry. Just petty and hating on the middle aged and female gender ;-)


Jimmy spent a lot of money to remove amalgams and yank out a bunch of rotten teeth last year. He has spent thousands on keto strips. He could afford insurance, he chooses not to. He made the choice to support his family with his low carb business. I don't know if he has been denied insurance in the past, but he can get it now. The man is not rich, heck, recent comments from him would lead most to believe he's struggling. That doesn't mean he hasn't made a small fortune off of his game. That just doesn't go very far when it's the sole support for two people. He has college degrees so it really is a shame he isn't employed by a company with a good benefit package for him and his wife.

Steve G said...

First, let me say, thank you, for your tireless work. I've learned a great deal over the last couple of years.
I prefer to read rather than write on blogs, but I was reading an article earlier today from the American Council on Exercise (ACE) that talked about putting your snack foods in a drawer and label it "unhealthy". I suppose this would create something of a mental challenge, and would keep the items out of sight.
However, I believe putting the above photo of JM looking longingly at that brick of butter on the drawer, the fridge, or anywhere else you might be tempted to grab a unhealthy snack would do the trick.

It reminds me of the Shining, "Here's Jimmy".

The article is interesting if you care to check it out.

https://www.acefitness.org/prosourcearticle/3798/take-the-decision-out-of-decision-making-how

Wuchtamsel said...

Is this supposed to be a smile? At least he shows his teeth... Really hard to recognize the facial expressions below all that fat-mask.

Screennamerequired said...

I used to be shocked and disgraced that people listen to him. But once you realise there's a lot of wacky fringe groups that have their supporters you come to the conclusion that in the internet diet/blog realm his not really an anomaly. Fringe groups lead the other fringe groups . It is just so vast. Moral or the story, follow credible mainstream sceince

Wuchtamsel said...

I absolutely concur. The internet is such a great tool for lunatics to find company...
I mean, really, it's so depressing, isn't it? There is the WHOLE knowledge of the world at our (and their!) hands and so many fools chose to believe in just EVERY stupid hoax there is. Hard not to get misanthropic about that.

Wuchtamsel said...

Great idea. In Germany we use pictures of the former football player and manager Reiner Calmund for that purpose. Rumor has it he played Jabba the Hutt in Star Wars. He once publicly announced he was on the Atkins diet by the way, but it didn't seem to serve him well. Just coincidence I guess...

http://img.welt.de/img/auszeit/crop105853678/4378726789-ci3x2l-w620/Reiner-Calmund.jpg

Sanjeev Sharma said...

if you convinced him vegetables are a good way to get fatty acids to the lower intestines he would make Kerrygold suppositories

Sanjeev Sharma said...

And he'd facebook/tweet pics of himself puckering up in anticipation

carbsane said...

Oh lordie I'd recognize Galina Bedeveled's fake broken English anywhere. Last time it was loose skin. I'm surprised she doesn't address that guy as Eeddie, though she seems to have learned to spell Jimmy ... for years he was Jemmy. Can't wait for her next comment on how her advises landed a young lady in the hospital with ketoacidosis over on Nurse Natalie's wee wee pad. It would appear old NV has an "out wish" these days. I'm happy to assist if she'd like, but the Menlo Park Mall Sephora is a bit out of my way (grin). Maybe I'll just drop Tess or Galina's real full names into every other post here until she comes out or Eddie shuts up or both or whatever.

If you really believe in your cause folks, blog about it, bring the science, go for it. Ad hominem attacks on me aren't going to bring you anything but the wrong kind of attention at this point. But it would appear that's what "Jane Plain" wants, because there is no other explanation for her reckless behavior.

carbsane said...

Apparently eating butter makes you think better. I'm thinking "not so much".

http://vimeo.com/50667879

Derek Hurst said...

By "having no insurance", it's another great way to receive donations - people would like to see tests that he supposedly cannot afford due to no insurance. Strike up the donations and I can afford x, y, and z tests...

marksuave25 said...

I don't hate. Lol. I would say that jimmy has not made a small fortune, or if he did he isn't spending it wisely. I know that he traveled to Australia last year and goes on a cruise every year. If he chooses to go do that and not have health insurance he is taking too much risk in my opinion. Now him spending thousands on keto sticks and getting his teeth pulled. I know plenty of poor people who smoke 2 or more packs of cigs a day that's a lot of money. Also this whole thing with butter. I think I may use like 2 sticks of butter.....a year. Even when I ate eggs everyday when I was on a low carb diet, butter just doesn't taste all that appetizing to me. Also I would rather eat a super lean piece of ground beef, veggies and a plain jane potatoe...hold the butter and sour cream! Lol.

Susan said...

So Jimmy must be a friggin' genius by now, huh? #notsomuch

rudyInLA said...

I was thinking about this last night while reading some posts on a diabetes website and I just have to believe JM doesn't eat the way he says! He may eat an apple pie a day for all I know and how would I find out? He'd probably be better off if just admitted it and ate 2 a day. I picture him in a disguise going through Sonic Burger at night pigging out. Now, I have no way of knowing this of course, and mental impairment is not rare in this date and age, but he could come out tomorrow and totally change his schtick to vegetarian and people would still be his sycophants. Anyway, Dave Asprey by his recent history seems to be an intelligent guy, at marketing anyway, but when I see him and hear him speak, I get the distinct impression he's lying and laughing at viewers or worse, he often appears to just be an idiot as he does in my opinion on this linked clip! What do I know? I know enough not to pretend I have secret knowledge of how my body operates or what some ancient relative ate for breakfast. Just annoying but it IS interesting to watch.

Susanne said...

But he can't be denied now for preexisting conditions, and if he and his wife are that low-income they'll qualify for subsidies; I think the maximum premium for the exchange plans are supposed to be less than 2% of income. And the required covered benefits include cholesterol and BP screening and diet counseling! :)

Susanne said...

I got the Heart 411 book* for my mom after it was reviewed on the Science Based Medicine site (? Or maybe on Weighty Matters? No I think it was SBM) and they have a whole chapter on diagnostic tests. The most interesting part of that are the criteria they use for "should we give this test?" You don't do a test just because you can. 1) some tests have risks which outweigh benefits in some circumstances; the "stress test" is one, and of course anything which is invasive. 2) don't give any tests in which the result would not affect your decision to treat. That is, don't do a test just for "informational" purposes. I feel like that's what JM does a lot.

*the authors are Cleveland clinic cardio doctors.

Hello_I_Love_You said...

Galina? I'm missing the whole inside joke. Nurse Natalie and Menlo Park Mall? Eddie, Jane Plain? I just lifted that post from the UK site to show the role of leptin in inducing broken metabolism, which is more than just blood sugar. Hormonal dysfunction results from leptin deficiency, whether congenital or acquired. Acquired in the case of those who've long-term VLCed. Going from one extreme to another is behind the problems many low-carbers are experiencing.
http://nutrition.highwire.org/content/134/9/2469S.full

carbsane said...

Hi there :-) Sorry for being cryptic. Galina L posts everywhere and seemingly can't spell the name of the person she's reponding to correctly. I am usually Evelyne or something like that, Jimmy was Jemmy. Recently when criticizing me, she managed two proper spellings in a single comment! I've seen her compose perfectly spelling/grammar posts at times, then others it seems deliberate. At some point, a person needs to pay attention to simple details like spelling a name correctly out of respect. I would bet that is her comment. I'm pretty sick and tired of the muckraking she does pretending innocence. The Nurse Natalie and the mall are jabbing at Wooo who thinks she's being cute with her attacks on me. Well, I don't think it's cute so she should take that under advisement. I'm convinced she wants to be outed so she can blame the poor victim. Had to get that funning out :)


I agree, BG is more than insulin and metabolic dysfunction is more than blood glucose.

carbsane said...

Thanks Steve! It means a lot to get your feedback and support!

carbsane said...

Asprey is a marketing genius and that's about it. More offensive than a weight loss success story that isn't , to me anyway, is a weight loss success story where the guy was never obese. So many of these folks say they were obese (Asprey claims 300 lbs, Eades claims considerable but never gives a number) or had health problems (Kresser unspecified for example) but there's no way to know as they don't share. Nobody is required to do so, but if that is your reason/support then yeah, they kinda are.

carbsane said...

LOL

carbsane said...

Asprey did potato starch enemas. Gives new meaning to his last name ... ;-)

carbsane said...

Jimmy once told a reporter he makes like 2-3X more than he used to. He writes off a cruise per year and multiple other travels. But he has likely raked in a gross of half to one million dollars over the decade. That's a tidy sum. That he used that to support his family and on random medical tests and whatever doesn't change the fact that he has profited from his gigs.

I cannot think of a single "guru" that relies on such a business for their sole livelihood. I'm sure there's someone out there, but Eades can alway sgo back to practicing medicine + his wife is a doc too. Taubes has no financial issues unless they are reckless investors. Robb has his gym, plus his wife's business, Naughton is a programmer or something, plus his wife is an artist. I could go on, but you get my point I think. We have friends where he is a very successful home remodeler -- million dollar homes and remodels -- and his wife works at Trader Joes part time JUST for the benefits. So Jimmy's situation is of his own making, but whatever.

carbsane said...

I'm willing to bet he'll pay the fine. As I pointed out to Mark above, there are ways to get insurance ... retail is kinda sucky but a part time job just for the bennies is something many do. Christine is not disabled to the best of my knowledge. This is their choice.

carbsane said...

I think hes demonstrated he's a rat and been one long enough to believe he has a metabolic "tail".

carbsane said...

We discussed back and forth. You're probably right. Examiner is a joke.

Wuchtamsel said...

Yeah, the Fat Head blog is really one of the worst... These LC-guys are really "farming" idiots. Not sure if this is paleo, eh? :-p

carbsane said...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdDfF4hXfj4



Oops there's a raisin! :p

charles grashow said...

http://www.bulletproofexec.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/headshots_w_progress.jpg.scaled500.jpg

charles grashow said...

BTW - salt is now NOT allowed on the paleo diet - what's next?

http://thepaleodiet.com/sea-salt-devil-deep-blue-sea/

Salt is definitely not Paleo, and neither is sea salt.

Cordially,

Loren Cordain, Ph.D., Professor Emeritus

marksuave25 said...

Well if he is making the conscious decision, which it sounds like he is, to not have health insurance then he deserves whatever happens to him. That's like not having life insurance and you own a home and have a family. Highly irresponsible.

Lighthouse Keeper said...

A low carb comedy gem,

Lighthouse Keeper said...

Yes that was reviewed on science based medicine by Harriet Hall under the title of " An Owners Manual for the heart"
The authors recommend the Mediterranean Diet as do virtually all cardiologists.

River Rance said...

Christine not disabled? She's Jimmy Moore's enabler..+.allowed him to publicly humiliate her on You Tube regarding her failed pregnancy .... and I find that sad .... Jimmy is at the very least a sociopath....

River Rance said...

Low Carb/Keto/Low Fat/JimKKKins/What Ever Guru?.....Ya kidding me? Kurt Harris was prophetic when he said "jimmy moore" is co-opting the paleo movement .... Yep...'dem LC/Paleo's gotta be proud of their Guru 'dat bought him hook line and sinker....Jimmy 'da Moore .... 'DA MAN!!! Fooling all the fools. Robbie ya listening....Markie Mark ya listening....bowing at the feet of THE MAN.....Jimmy M........!
Nuts!!

Hello_I_Love_You said...

Right on, I also happen to think high FBG on a VLC/ketogenic diet is not just physiological insulin resistance but cortisol, which would dysregulate insulin secretion. Some of these guys continue to have high BG even when they quit VLCing and switch to normal carb intake.

The same with elevated CRP: it's not always metabolic inflammation. It could be hormonal or undetected autoimmunity. We see this plenty among those who've VLCed long-term.

Kade Storm A.K.A. Hedonist said...

...I should really stop drinking and reading at the same time.

NEPAer said...

When will yor book be avail?

rudyInLA said...

PT Barnum had it figured out right? Sucker born every minute. Unfortunately, a lot of people who follow these guys are desperate, not suckers. Even JM I suspect in his quieter moments would like to know the truth about himself and his health, but maybe he has totally brainwashed himself.

rudyInLA said...

It's sad in a lot of ways, but infuriating in others. He doesn't need all those tests, just a mirror. As much as people don't like to hear it, we really can judge a lot about our health just by looking at ourselves. It actually in the end is not rocket science in my opinion. In fact, a little knowledge, which is all these gurus have AT BEST, can mess you up more than anything! Pretending you understand hormones and body processes interact along with metabolism leads you to butter mania, shake tables, egg diets, manic avoidance of catbs and so on. I've fallen victim to it and I think I've been cured of it for a long time.

carbsane said...

She is showing late stages of Stockholm syndrome ;-)

carbsane said...

When comments load slowly you can sometimes see them in the old Blogger layout. So that might be why they appeared to be disappearing?

carbsane said...

Jimmy flat out lied to everyone in 2012 when he went around talking about his nutritional ketosis. This is his slide from his talks on the matter. There is no way to put this but a lie. And his wife sits there and "that's my Jimmy!" and his LC buddies don't say a word, etc.

carbsane said...

Didn't their vessels widen to accommodate the intimal thickening or something like that? It's been a while. In any case, they aren't armchair warriors!

carbsane said...

Interestingly (have to see if I can find it), a recent study showed that cheese intake = good vs. butter. So what else is in cheese and milk that isn't in butter -- insulinogenic / insulin-sensitizing protein perhaps?

carbsane said...

Haven't checked up to see if she's still so super healthy.

carbsane said...

I don't know, that William Lagakos surprises me with everything he writes. Either the education system has really fallen apart (possible) or there's something going on there. I could see it if he were formerly obese and became a convert by losing weight on LC but that doesn't appear to be the case either.

carbsane said...

LOL ... It's the opposite really once you get past the digestion which is not nearly as variable as that author would like folks to believe. Metabolic "burning" for energy is highly efficient and the same in the end for every special snowflake.

carbsane said...

You keep thinking they'll throw him under the bus any day now. I suspect once the KetoClarity book tanks and Victory Belt is done with him perhaps the paleo circus part ends. I don't think he can support himself on his "pure" LC anymore.

rudyInLA said...

I don't know much about that whole Keto thing. I only vaguely remember a bit about it in the Atkins book. On some web sites, it is COMICAL how involved and invested in the Keto thing, often citing JM which is in itself comical if you look at him and his "cherry picked" numbers he publishes. there are people on there, and I'm not exaggerating, who are moaning about their diabetes more out of control than ever, critically low on energy as to be unable to even stand up at times, and just how TERRIBLE they feel! Then, someone suggests they give up the ketone thing and they EXPLODE with "No....I'm gonna's stick it out! This will work I just know it!" Whatever works happens to mean to them. Then the flood of that Volek Phinney book again and the cut and paste wars begin! I can almost guarantee you that maybe 5% of readers have a clue what those guys are talking about and there is also a chance the AUTHORS may not know what they're talking about either! Just stupid and I mean that literally. It's maddening and seems it might be very damaging to those probes to follow this idiocy at all costs!

Wuchtamsel said...

It's making me so sick that the publisher introduces JM as a "leading health blogger".
This is so wrong I just can't find words for it. A "leading health blogger" eating a stick of butter for breakfast... What was the name of that (bad) movie? Idiocracy?

Pedro said...

Don't you know that the Eskimos ate ketogenic diets, and they were sooooo healthy? And some Massai also. And the ketones go to your brain and give you superpowers!

rudyInLA said...

Gee whiz....I don't know any Eskimos. I wonder when I see US soldiers in actual combat footage fought for days and days, scaled giant mountains under obvious stress (canon and gunfire!) and fought a literal death battle and I don't think I EVER saw them measuring ketones or using a fat/carb/protein calculator. Did US prisoners in Vietnam get their body scans for fat and stuff? A yeah, silly extreme examples.....and THAT'S MY POINT!

rudyInLA said...

He did what? He discussed a failed pregnancy the family suffered? I don't want to know anymore! OMG, that's the worst thing I have now heard about him! His wife is an enabler and seems more into the whole act now but boy in a lot of videos she looks like a prisoner suffering from Stockholm Syndrome! Deer in the headlights at best!

rudyInLA said...

EXACTLY!

carbsane said...

In 2011, Jimmy Moore and his wife did an embryo adoption. He did a whole series of videos on YouTube chronicling the whole thing ... he used to post notices to them to the menus blog for some reason. I'm sure this was a running thing on FB but I wasn't on there at the time. It was icky weird to do in the first place. He posted updates less frequently on the main blog.

Then he posted this video WITHOUT WARNING on menus blog. I will warn you, it is a horrible thing to do to your wife, and it's all STILL there on YouTube. He should have been comforting her, not filming this. He didn't make the announcement on the main blog until days later while congratulations on the pregnancy were still coming in. This is not a well man and there's something not right about her for going along with this. Of course my detractors will use this comment as evidence of my attacking them. SIGH.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-_Kpm85aEM

Lighthouse Keeper said...

Same here, keyboards tend not to appreciate a drenching of gin & tonic.

rudyInLA said...

You couldn't PAY me to click that link and I won't. Not now or ever! Ughhhhh.....

charles grashow said...

https://twitter.com/livinlowcarbman/status/458582335009853441

Jimmy Moore
‏@livinlowcarbman

Getting an alignment for my car & the guy at front desk just diagnosed with Type 2 diabetes last week. Sharing how #lowcarb can help him.

charles grashow said...

http://www.amazon.com/Keto-Clarity-Definitive-Benefits-Low-Carb/dp/1628600071/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1398179754&sr=1-3&keywords=jimmy+moore

"The solid evidence for nutritional ketosis in dealing with many of the
chronic health problems of our day is presented, including: epilepsy,
Type 2 diabetes, obesity, cardiovascular disease, metabolic syndrome,
polycystic ovarian syndrome (PCOS), irritable bowel syndrome (IBS),
heartburn (GERD), nonalcoholic fatty liver disease (NAFLD). The good
evidence for ketogenic diets is also shared in dealing with Alzheimer’s
Disease (AD), Parkinson’s Disease, dementia, mental illness,
schizophrenia, bipolar, depression, narcolepsy, and sleep disorders.
Plus, you’ll get the details on the emerging science that is showing
great promise in treating cancer, autism, migraines, chronic pain, brain
injury, stroke, kidney disease and so much more. Keto Clarity is your
definitive guide to the benefits of a low-carb, high-fat diet. Full
details on Jimmy Moore’s yearlong n=1 scientific experiment of
nutritional ketosis, in which he used sophisticated blood testing
technology to track and monitor his production of ketones and blood
sugar to achieve rather remarkable effects on his weight and health, is
also presented as well as food shopping lists, 25+ low-carb, high-fat
recipes, and a 21-day meal plan to get you going on your ketogenic
lifestyle change."

Sanjeev Sharma said...

OMG I furrowed my brow, tilted my head to the side, did the Spock one-eyebrow raise, a certain lower body puckering and the "urinal shudder"

Sanjeev Sharma said...

just for consistency & fairness, realize that if he's either deluded or eating-disordered a mirror will NOT help; EDs cause distort perception and delusions can be a symptom of distorted perception

rudyInLA said...

I have to admit I didn't think about that. I really think he doesn't have that problem, but I could be wrong of course. he documents everything too closely to think he's "rock in' it" with his lifestyle doesn't he?

David Pete said...

Faith is a powerful drug

rudyInLA said...

As is money and notoriety.

David Pete said...

In my opinion only: JM is mired in an eating disorder, so I feel some empathy toward him (ok not much, but some), Asprey is snake oil salesman of the first order

David Pete said...

My premiums are 10% of my earnings, so that statement is false

Wuchtamsel said...

If I remember correctly they have (or had) a median life expectancy of ~40 years at that time. Major causes of death being infections and violence. It's not surprising that at that age there won't be CVD events, even wirth the SEVERE atheresclerosis they had. To cite that as an example to "prove" the cardiovascular "benefits" of a low carb diet is embarassing at best.

Wuchtamsel said...

Maybe Vitamin K2 if the Rotterdam study got it right. But I'm not sure, partly because this result was taken so positive by the notoric LC crowd...
There also are peptides in certain cheeses that work like natural ACE inhibitors. Could be another important mechanism.

rudyInLA said...

I'm waiting for the 365 day "Slow Fast Diet." No food for one year, but then eat all you want the next, repeat. Of course there are supplements available to help and of course, "eating" will be redefined as no food other than Quest Bars. Brilliant!

carbsane said...

I am hoping by next week. We are dealing with some health issues with my father in law who does not live locally. I really want to have the complete package with updates and no typos (or as few as possible, those always bother me in books!!) and this takes more concentration and blocked time than blogging or goofing off on FB to relieve stress. Almost there :)

rudyInLA said...

I'm sorry if this is too far off topic and please just delete it if it is! I won't take offense. Has anyone SEEN that Low Carb Conversation site of his? It's COMICAL! What the heel is that?!? Man can you think of more way to cram asking for money into every pixel of white space? It's indescribable it really it is. Looks like a 7 year old designed it! I don't care how much money that site brings in, it's an eyesore? I gues it ldoesn't really matter but it tells me a lot about this guy. I was tempted to click the link on why Canola Oil is NOT better than Olve Oil! NOT!!!!! What a tired old nothing act all these idiots keep playing.

Hello_I_Love_You said...

Most of those positive effects are temporary and due to weight loss. As soon as you stall, you'll start experiencing side effects of starvation. That metabolic inflammation will be replaced by inflammation induced by autoimmune or hormonal dysregulation. That's why so many VLCers end up with allergic reactions and sudden food allergies. That is part and parcel of your body's breached immune homeostasis. That's exactly how low-carb Paleo sustains itself. You implement an extreme diet. In the process, you develop food allergies which you never had before. Then you do food restriction until you're left with organ meats, kale and coconut oil, which they'll then claim is nutritionally dense and will detox and boost your immune system.


It's a slippery slope to worsening health. It has worked because you confuse weight loss with health improvement. That is the biggest deception there is. Ketosis will expose you all kinds of health ills from which you'll never recover from. We're talking about serious, irreversible hormonal and immune dysregulation. And I have some evidence that these people are aware of this but are persisting because of their vested interest in the enterprise. The ketogenic/low-carb circus will go on until you bankrupt them. Until the low-carbers themselves realize that they've been had, it will still have staying power.

carbsane said...

I remember when he started that and had the caricature made. I was like what? That was in 2011 and really the first several episodes were like "enough is enough" for me. I couldn't stand by listening to these people tell a whole different story on his podcasts than they gave on their blogs.

carbsane said...

I imagine coconut oil production might scare a few people too :-)

carbsane said...

I agree. JM has been sucked in from external forces to *some* degree. Asprey is just snake oil. This man is so full of shit it astounds me that anyone promotes him.

rudyInLA said...

I tried listening to one of his podcasts a few minutes ago with some "expert" with what I thought sounded like an Australian accent. After some book bundle or something JM offered at a 97% discount at the start of the show. I lasted 10 minutes! The accent didn't help, but I swear she literally said nothing. There were words, but reading a dictionary in alphabetical order makes more sense than she seemed to. I had to stop, never to return! Now I'm getting worked up! I just thought people seeking advice would be smarter than that!!!!!

Donnie Reilly said...

Don't you people get it?!? His haters only make him more famous! Or is it stronger? I can't remember.

Remember him in that t-shirt? Just LOL.

Sue Staltari said...

Some expert called naturopath jen?

charles grashow said...

Look at the picture on his website
http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/

Wonder when that was taken?

rudyInLA said...

I just looked on my Apple TV which is what I often use. Yes. That's her. I'm sure she 's a nice lady and all but that's not the issue.

rudyInLA said...

Was it Bigger? Probably not.

rudyInLA said...

You mean photoshopped I think.

EatLessMoveMoore said...

Substitute "lowcarb" for "bornagainchristianity" and only a few of the details need to be changed. Such is the essence of Jimmy Moore.

EatLessMoveMoore said...

I don't have the time or inclination to find them right now, but there are a number of videos of him more or less bullying Christine (coated with that Southern sweetness & light, of course).

Screennamerequired said...

It is pretty interesting that he has embraced the evil blood sugar raising carbohydrate. Every low carber eventually comes to the conclusion that it isn't that great of an idea. Some don't though, they spend years and years sticking to the same paradigm with their health getting worse and worse. Low carb gurus capitalize on this with supplements and gimmicks.

I'm not really sure how many of the paleo tenants have to get destroyed before people realize that they have been suckered into another fad. It's almost funny that "paleo" today is getting closer and closer to the US food plate.

Screennamerequired said...

That's classic. I tried gluten free bread a while ago and it was such an abonimation that I can't understand why anyone besides geniuine celiacs would subject themselves to it.

Steve G said...

A thought, Münchausen syndrome, with his wife by proxy, but with himself and his continuous failings, he garners support and expressions of sympathy. This is not Münchausen syndrome in the classical sense but more of a Histrionic personality disorder. From wikipedia; People with HPD have a high need for attention, make loud and inappropriate appearances, exaggerate their behaviors and emotions, and crave stimulation. Associated features include egocentrism, self-indulgence, continuous longing for appreciation, and persistent manipulative behavior to achieve their own needs.

Disclaimer, I am not a doctor, and I have not played one on TV. I have however stayed at a Holiday Inn express. In real life I am a Detective, and have played one on TV. For what that's worth.

Cheers.

Steve G said...

I suppose "BYOB" takes on a whole new meaning.

Bris Vegas said...

"Ketosis will expose you all kinds of health ills from which you'll never
recover from. We're talking about serious, irreversible hormonal and
immune dysregulation."

Your body can largely reverse just about any lifestyle disease in a remarkably short time (as little as 4-6 weeks for many conditions) by changing to a healthy lifestyle. The idea that ketosis (or any other diet) causes irreversible hormonal and immune damage is simply not correct.

Any low carber who changed to a healthy diet would most likely have normal BP, blood lipids, thyroid status etc within a year.

Bris Vegas said...

The US Army actually tested high fat LC Inuit style diets during WW2. The results were an unmitigated disaster with the soldiers actually showing greatly reduced performance.



The Masai actually consume a large amount of lactose and are not ketotic.

Bris Vegas said...

I was suggesting the Masai diet was bad because they had severe atherosclerosis.

carbsane said...

No "EatLessMoveMoore" ... I will not publish comments by you.

rudyInLA said...

That's a pretty interesting thought. Another explanation, simplistic maybe, would be as I would have said as a kid watching these folks eat and talk, "Those guys are crazy!" From the mouths of babes.....

Wuchtamsel said...

Not to forget about self-inflicted harm! I would say that eating a stick of butter regularly is at least on par with rubbing sawdust into wounds for example...

Wuchtamsel said...

Yes I realized that, of course. It's the LC-people that always use the Massai as their "proof".

Glenn Dixon said...

Charles Washington, Mr. 0-carb marathon runner, would probably disagree w/ you on LC and exercise. But then he hasn't added a blog post in the last year, so...?

Wuchtamsel said...

Yes it's once more stunning how similar those "hermetic groups" are in the end in their social mechanisms. UFOlogists and LCers have a lot in common. But UFOlogists at least don't ruin their physical health...

Lighthouse Keeper said...

The gurus will have to draw the line somewhere or else paleo will end up as a whole food diet minus bread - but then sour dough might creep in, without an identity there is nothing to market.
They begrudgingly let in legumes and slammed the door only to find the rest of the resistant starch family knocking on the other side. Now some low carbers are eating resistant starch, no doubt claiming it's not for them but they are simply feeding their gut bacteria just like a vegan serving up dogmeat to his mutt.
Low carbers are always good for a giggle and the paleo movement is bloody hilarious.

Wuchtamsel said...

By the way, he somehow looks as if he was melting away, isn't he? A side effect of all that butter in his body?

rudyInLA said...

I find it difficult to read Tom's blog and it's been that way for a while. Yeah, he's also a pretty dogmatic guy right now, but for some reason he doesn't me anywhere near as much as the other guys do. I'm not really into what has become his Farm Report and How to Build a Chicken Coop stories, but some seem to. He set out to stop food vilification and seems to have "over-corrected" his thinking. Hi may come around if his health takes the turn many of us have noticed after his lifestyle starts to fail him. Anyway, all I can say is at least the man does real work as a programmer and does his thing. He's hardly the only non-funny comedian there is. I never thought Bob Hope or Milton Berle were funny either! I'm not defending Tom, Not my job, he doesn't need or want me to, and I don't care what he does anyway. Just sayin.....

MacSmiley said...

Another lamb to the slaughter?

MacSmiley said...

The Eskimos eat more carbs than many realize ( contents of caribou entrails, anyone?) and are genetically resistant to ketosis.

Jimmy is not an Eskimo.

charles grashow said...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeAhhWn2h_Q

charles grashow said...

http://carbsanity.blogspot.com/2012/07/nutritional-idiotosis.html

charles grashow said...

http://www.lowcarbcruiseinfo.com/

Come Hear From Our Special Guest Speaker Lineup For 2014:

Dr. Eric Westman
Dr. Jayson and Mira Calton
Dr. Jeffry Gerber
Jackie Eberstein
Jimmy Moore
Christine Cronau
Wendy Myers
Dr. George Diggs/Dr. Kerry Brock
Franziska Spritzler
Tommy Runesson
Maria Emmerich
Dana Carpender
Rocky Angelucci
Emily Maguire
Dr. Adam Nally
Fred Hahn

Richard Nikoley said...

I stopped publishing them too, Evelyn.

rudyInLA said...

Are Quest bars gathered or hunted?

Gwen1961 said...

Evelyn, my apologies for disrupting conversation with an O/T question: do you have an email address for a private message? Thank you.

rudyInLA said...

I wonder what's left for them to discuss? Tax write off strategies? Paleo cupcake breakthroughs?

rudyInLA said...

HEY the voice that machine uses to tell you to hold your breath is the SAME VOICE used in 2001 A Space Odyssey for the Security check in! Honest!

rudyInLA said...

You just jogged my aging memory. There are youtube films of Keys feeding different diets to soldiers early in WW2 lifting weights, in cold rooms with just swimming trunks, running with masks measuring whatever they knew how to measure back then (O2, CO2?). good point! The research resulted in the K Ration!

carbsane said...

Good on you and thank you for being one of the few who recognized and didn't play along with stupid trolls impersonating me.


Now about appearing on butter boy's podcast ... Oh nevermind.

EatLessMoveMoore said...

I'm doing your work, Evie. You got the whole ball rolling. We're in this thing together. If the opposition attacks one another, the terrorists win.

Richard Nikoley said...

Wait an listen, Evelyn.... I should be getting the files out today.

charles grashow said...

Both

Radhakrishna Warrier said...

I think I know the website and the people that Rudy mentions :) It is really comical to watch the low carb/ketosis/ketogenic diet circus on these sites. In ketosis induced nirvana, guys (and gals) there keep reciting the holy book of Volek and Phinney. They seem to be in the bliss eternal that Ketosis bestows on its devotees :)

Regards,
Rad

Donnie Reilly said...

I'll listen to you on there. It'll be the first time in forever that I've listened to JM's podcast.

Donnie Reilly said...

Fred Hahn? What's he going to talk about? His comments he posts on people's blogs?

Richard Nikoley said...

Donnie:


To be clear, it's me guest hosting JM's program; and truth is, he told me: "your show, do what you want."


I interviewed my book collaborators Tim Steele and Grace Liu (AnimalPharm blog) about aspects of resistant starch and in particular how LCers might benefit even if staying LC (not eating cooked as cooled rice, beans, potatoes...or green bananas, etc). In the last segment I bring on Tom Naughton who, because of his experience with resistant starch has upped his intake of carbs to what he calls more Perfect Health Diet levels.


So, it was not a show to slam LC, which would not be very nice since I'm a guest, but there is plenty of stuff for LCers to chew on.

Pedro said...

No humans try to stay in a ketogenic state naturally, all these groups mentioned by keto adherents, apart from being a minute fraction of the world population, ate carbs the moment they could get their hands on them or ate huge amounts of proteine. Maybe according to their experience that made them healthier, stronger and feel better, contrary to VLC insight? There are other issues such as cholesterole, excessive iron intake, stomach issues, thyroid problems, etc. which make recommending that diet to the general public irresponsible, particularly when this is done by gurus who lack the scientific background. Throwing in some evolutionary or paleo catchwords does not count as science in this case.

carbsane said...

sure ... carbsane at gmail dot com Look forward to hearing from you!

carbsane said...

Fred gives seminars on how to exercise just the "right" amount -- no more than 5 min every other week or something like that. ;)

carbsane said...

I only recently noticed that Andreas Eenfeldt and his band of roving Swedes will not be there to photograph fat Americans this year! No Tom Naughton roast either. There are certainly some disappointments on that list. (from here: http://carbsanity.blogspot.com/2012/12/jimkkkins-saga-of-jimmy-moore-and-david.html)

carbsane said...

Nah ... that was from 2005 before he upped the fat and stopped the cardio.

EatLessMoveMoore said...

Evie: I have helped you in more ways than you could possibly repay. Yes, you provided the ideological impetus, but it was I who took your message - and the fight - to the streets. We all know that Paleo/LC has now been relegated to the fringes (where it will probably remain) - but that is all because of infighting over relatively inconsequential issues. And who was it that promulgated much of that infighting? I will remain silent on that one... Either way, I understand you have to disavow my efforts, but know that without your blowing the whistle on all this craziness, there would be no EatLessMoveMoore (or the many, many others who carry the fight on in your name and spirit). As for Dick, he can go fuck himself. And you can tell him I said so. ;)

charles grashow said...

You mean when he was HEALTHY??

Lighthouse Keeper said...

That's a "What's the sound of one hand clapping' question, low carb/paleo satori may well ensue.

Lighthouse Keeper said...

You see many low carb/paleo advocates wallowing in their presumed fragility. The more tests they have done the more hypochondriacal they become, it's a case of "first world whining" writ large. Antonio Valladares has spoken well on this matter in the last Evil Sugar Radio podcast. (' Don't believe the hype' episode ).

carbsane said...

You seem to have mistaken me for someone who gives a shit about your little project. Please don't misconstrue my allowing your comment as any sort of invitation for further discourse or permission to do so in the future.

rudyInLA said...

That's a bad example! I can't show you here....and thus can't prove it but I CAN CLAP WITH ONE HAND! I've been able to since I was a kid. Only my right hand. Hard to explain. I've seen video of others doing it as well. Anyway,k sorry to waste the bandwidth but I do so few things well, I never miss a chance to show this freakish skill.

rudyInLA said...

You're so right that we need a new word for right! I have seen so many posts on various sites where there are many people post over and over "You don't understand! I'm not like everyone else! There's something wrong with me and I don't respond to food the way everyone else on earth does!" This thought is rampant in the Type 2 diabetic community and drives me nuts! I don't know if it's legal and allowed on this site but if I posted some actual posts from other people on some of these sites, you'd swear I made them up. A form of mental illness to my layman mind's understanding.

charles grashow said...

When Tom and JM get together for their annual frisbee festival what will he say about the Pillsbury Doughboy's appearance??

charles grashow said...

For someone who is supposedly a free thinker and open to al l concepts you seem to been unable to take any criticism - banning people who disagree with you for example! And we won't even go into the name calling.

rudyInLA said...

He's built a chicken coop and bought a chain saw. If that doesn't qualify as diet expertise what does?

Lighthouse Keeper said...

Yes you have a point, mind you these bars probably cost an arm and a leg anyway.

rudyInLA said...

touché‘

charles grashow said...

BTW Richard - you and JM have a lot in common - neither one of you has a clue as to what to eat - look at all of the crazy N=1 experiments you've tried - like the month long GOMAD diet for example

You're also either a smoker or someone who's trying to quit - why else would you post a photo of you using e-cigs?

You're probably an alcoholic as well and probably either pre-diabetic or full-blown T2D - why else all of the posts on RS and it's effects on blood sugar? Scared out of your mind you'll have to back on LC which you now say is practically worthless?

In addition - who really gives a rats ass as to whether or not the Inuit were in ketosis or not - this is so far in the weeds it's pathetic

rudyInLA said...

That photo is literally repulsive! OMG how about a warning next time! Yechhhhh......

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