11 Unexpected Health Hazards Of The Atkins Diet Besides Weight Gain
Timely Repost!
Here's a question for y'all. How many obese people do you see in concentration camps? How do you think their cortisol levels are doing? Jimmy Moore is at it again, lying about his weight. You see, he insists that he hasn't changed a thing since May of 2013, and the same fasting 18-24 hours at a clip and 2000 calorie boluses of fat laced with protein has not only failed to produce additional weight loss, but has resulted in what appears to be a complete regain of the 2012-2013 NuttyK "Experiment" weight loss. It's the stress Jimmy claims.
It's hard to believe it's been three years since most in the paleo community actually "met" Jimmy Moore. At the time, he was going on various podcasts and exclaiming that he was the healthiest he's been in his life. Jimmy didn't go on many other people's podcasts until that time, and it became rather frustrating to hear his protestations of health despite objectively appearing unwell. This, by the way, irrespective of his weight per se. This was pre-NuttyK, and I think this Abel James podcast might be worth a listen for some. (If anyone does listen and you can give me a time stamp for when Jimmy exclaims he's the healthiest in his adult life, or if I'm misremembering that from this podcast, much thanks!)
But then Jimmy lost around 80 lbs and out came the truth-mobile. Oh, Jimmy doesn't see it this way, but in an article for Carbsmart, we were finally treated to the truth about all the health issues Jimmy had been suffering from when his "healthy high fat, moderate protein, low carb diet" had caused fat to accumulate once again upon his body.
So this post was a play off of that article. It wasn't intended to be serious. Amusingly, some took notice on Facebook thinking it was a real article on my part. I had initially forgotten the link to Jimmy's article, so some others were up in arms over my trashing low carb. But the thing is -- and there's not much data on this in the scientific literature because humans don't eat that way in perpetuity in the wild!!! -- whatever you want to call the syndrome, long time low carbing tends to sneak up on a person in the form of symptoms one doesn't immediately associate with the diet. This is why it IS important to talk about them, Jimmy, not poo poo their existence. It actually HELPS people to identify the possible negatives of the diet.
Carbohydrate restriction is metabolic starvation, and it is apparently perceived that way by the body. It's a CONSTANT state of low grade stress that manifests in many as sleep disorders. Whether it's the thyroid, or the adrenals, or the immune system, or the liver, or the kidneys, or whatever ... it's a pattern that is reported over and over again. And it is also a pattern observed in many who don't report it! There is a classic image of a trash can at AHS -- where all the healthy beautiful people congregated -- filled with coffee cups. Why so much caffeine flowing? Also, does it not seem odd that a community so obsessed over fat burning beasts goes out of its way to accomodate drinking, and often we're not talking one or two?
It would be one thing were this the trade off for a truly effortlessly svelte figure the way the diet books and guru bloggers make it out to be. At least most celebrities have the "decency" to just lie outright. But mostly it is just insulting to the intelligence to hear the stories of boundless energy to be expected once one is off the mythical blood sugar roller coaster, later to be treated to confession after confession of the realities of life for these folks. I think this is why keto was such a rage amongst so many long term low carbers, because at least temporarily, the heightened ketones were like cocaine! (Look up the whole brain fog/mental clarity thing with cocaine in the short term and the long term. The parallels are uncanny.) Couple that with the buzz of losing weight and it's a nice wave to ride for a while. Then the dust settles. So Jimmy Moore is "wired and tired" and back up to around the 300 lb mark. Just don't go pointing out that someone who makes their living as a weight loss success story and health advocate is so objectively unhealthy. HAES stands for Health .... Jimmy Moore does not qualify no matter which cherry picked biomarkers he deludes himself into thinking are the only ones that matter.
Now, to find the time to write the serious article of this nature!
First Repost 9/14/13
(I was going to remove this, but left it so comments will make sense). Well, I don't know how many of my regular blog readers follow that Twitter update over there on the sidebar, or check me out on Facebook, but the past day or so has been quite interesting! Apparently Jimmy Moore is very upset that anyone would dare to post anything other than a stevia coated endorsement of Cholesterol Clarity and he's marshaled the troops! On Friday, within a matter of hours the number of reviews almost doubled because he was very upset that there were negative reviews there! I guess sales aren't so hot so he needed his friends to post even more 5-star platitudes to drown out the few negatives. More on that at some point.... But one of his fans seemed especially bothered that I might give the book a mere 2 stars (one more than the book itself deserves). This would be Dr. Bill Wilson of The CARB Syndrome Project! Most folks probably haven't heard of him, and they are probably better off keeping it that way. Basically he believes that carbs scramble and fry your brains and I have now been diagnosed as being in the latter stages. He wrote a post all about it. He emailed me the link. He linked to it in comments here. He posted it on Facebook.
In his keen diagnosis, and he reminds us he's been a doctor for 35 years now, Dr. Wilson cites (without linked attribution) two comments of mine, one of which came verbatim from this post, the other probably from a comment, but I mention insomnia here. I've kept the post as is, but bolded in red the symptoms he cites. Perhaps the good doctor should address Diane Sanfilippo, or any one of the other various and sundry low carb and/or paleo zombies out there suffering from insomnia and the ensuing fatigue ... due to their sugar detoxes! Yes, doctor, “I was fatigued from time to time from sleep deprivation as I had raging insomnia” ... WHEN I WAS LOW CARB. Checking those off your list. You're barking up the wrong tree for sure looking at me.
Edit: The link to Sanfilippo's Facebook confession of chronic fatigue since AHS-2011 has been removed. There doesn't seem to have been any discussion in the interim of her overcoming this issue, so one must presume it is ongoing.
Originally Published 6/18/13
1. Carbohydrate Cravings and Hunger
By restricting carbohydrates you will discover your previously unknown addiction to carbohydrates and start craving them. The longer you do Atkins the fewer carbohydrates you will eventually be able to eat. Eventually even protein will lose its physiologically satiating properties and trigger hunger and cravings because a skinless chicken breast might as well be at Little Debbie cake.
2. Spontaneous Snacking
Initially you will lose your hunger, but over time you will need to eat every few hours, perhaps even more often. No way will intentional fasting be an option, intermittent or otherwise.
3. Brain Fog
Forget carb comas! You'll get that brain fog hitting you really hard even after eating a pretty decent low-carb meal.
4. Insomnia
Forget getting 7-8 hours of sleep, you'll be lucky to get 6 uninterrupted hours and should get used to the latest fad: intermittent sleeping. Never sleep more than 4 hours at a stretch.
5. Prediabetes
Your fasting blood glucose will creep up over time into prediabetic range. You will also see blood glucose spikes over 140 mg/dL from a slice of toast.
6. Muscle Atrophy and Weakness
It won't matter if you Slow Burn only once every 10 days! You still won't be able to increase your weights or see any indication of lean mass.
7. Inflammation
Increased CRP and other markers of inflammation.
8. Fatigue
Forget the low carb flu, in the long run you'll be dragging your feet in no time. Don't even think of leaving your headgear off during that 12 second Slow Burn workout because you might black out from the hypoglycemia and hit your head.
9. Exloding LDL particles of all sizes
Sure most of your LDL will be the cute fluffy kind you can dress up in designer apoB's, but you'll also get a lot of smaller ones mixed in.
10. Skin Disorders
Daily zit fests and annoying skin tags are just the beginning for you! Don't worry, the boils will become manageable.
Comments
I'm kinda paranoid about losing everything I've worked hard on.
Any tips?
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BTW in Australia doctors do not test for any blood lipid subfractions except HDL and LDL. The reason is because there is NO convincing evidence that they have any clinical relevance as risk factors. [In fact the average Australian cardiologist is typically far more concerned about a patient's diet and lifestyle than any laboratory test results.]
The Atkins Diet is by no means healthy and personally it raised my LDL-C to levels more than concerning. But I definetely never felt any better in my life than during this half year on Atkins. Not only did I lode a lot of weight, but I was more energetic than ever, slept better than ever and had NO cravings whatsoever.
And who the f*** has ever met ANYONE who gained weight on Atkins??? Is this a joke or what?
did you write this or is this copy/pasted from somewhere?
As to the last part? I've met lots of people over the past few years who have gained weight on a low carb diet. Also many staunch advocates who have regained some, all or more weight despite remaining either strictly LC or "not being perfect". Shhhhhh, don't tell anybody about those folks, right? <-- last comment there is not directed at you, just a general one.
I was going to type a reply like "Nope! Nope! Nope! Nope! Maybe. Nope! Dunno. Nope! Dunno. Nope! Nope!" , but decided not.....oh, bugger! :-D
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The deal-killer for me regarding "low carb as a way of life" is that I like to run, a big part of the reason I wanted to lose weight in the first place is so that I could start running again, and running on low carb is a fool's errand. Low carb doesn't work for running, biking or any other sustained aerobic activity. For athletic activity glucose is king.
Works okay for sedentary people though.
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One of the reasons Atkins became so influential is, that his opponents were complete fools and presented him publicly with perfect set-ups that he could demolish easily. The man was truly blessed in his choice of enemies.
Glad to see the tradition continues, only Jimmy Moore is being given the boost.
Funny you didn't mention bad breath. As evry ful kno, ketones smell sweet. Bad smells while dieting result from protein catabolism and are suppressed by adequate protein intake.
I didn't make anything up I was working off of Jimmy's list of 10, and added the 11th malady he fessed up to having when he was "healthiest he's ever been in his life" pre-NuttyK. I originally forgot the link and let it go, the response has been interesting ....
Atkins was the original sympathy seeking rebel who played off of his counter mainstream act. He was an original, and apparently many learned well from him. When one claim is dispelled, just switch to another and claim you were still right all along. This is why his diet will never be taken seriously and those who have followed have just doubled down on the made up claims. Sad really.
From some FB feedback, I'm planning on doing a more serious list of this nature as it is interesting how many people recognized some of this list as real to them.
Back in 2011, I wouldn't have considered myself sedentary but I certainly wasn't engaging in any sort of endurance activity. I was fatigued from time to time from sleep deprivation as I had raging insomnia. I would stay up later in hopes that once I zonked out I might sleep through the night, but that didn't work so I settled in at going to sleep around 9 or 10pm. I would invariably wake up around 1am, sometimes even as early as 11 unable to fall back asleep (if I was really exhausted and fell asleep early and woke up at 10-11pm it was very disorienting). After a while of failing to go back to sleep, I'd putter about the net reading, until I eventually fell asleep from exhaustion. If I was lucky that was 3am, but usually it was 4 or 5. It was no fun when the alarm went off at 6.
Now Jimmy is sleeping better because he's blacked out his windows and takes melatonin. No doubt losing weight has helped his stress level as well. But his is actually the opposite of what most experience on VLC as time progresses. It sneaks up on you though, and I never thought myself to connect it to low carbing. All I ever heard was the positive, now at least I hear more confessions about it that I may have made the connection. Don't you think more honest testimonials are needed George?
From some FB feedback, I'm planning on doing a more serious list of this nature as it is interesting how many people recognized some of this list as real to them.
http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/controversial-interview-raises-ire-rises-to-top-of-itunes-health-podcast-charts/18569
Pretty much says it all. He's whining about McDougall not rallying around common ground ... because of the veggies of course ... they could have discussed how both McD and paleo are against dairy ... oh wait, Jimmy doesn't eat paleo ;-)
While it wasn't nearly as bad as some of the commentators made it out to be in the comments section, I heard the interview and I was still put off by McDougall's zeal and attitude. Nevertheless, something was seriously off about the whole situation. So just a quick Google search revealed that this was most likely the outcome of a stretched out baiting by Moore that dates back to McDougall finally accepting the offer to be interviewed this past February.
In other words, I believe that McDougall agreed to be interviewed on this pod cast looking for confrontation with bated breath.
It's just a fact that if your (or in this case my) LDL-C rises from 130ish to over 210 this is atherogenic beyond doubt. If you dispute that I don't think it makes much sense even to discuss any further. There is a pletora of rockhard science to prove that.
And no, aerobic performance can actually be pretty excellent even in individuals with rather severe atherosclerosis shortly before an imminent cardiovascular event.
McDougall asked a good question -- why has Jimmy struggled so much with his weight? Jimmy gets all defensive and all "look at me now" when the truth of the matter is that he has been closer to 300 lbs than 200 lbs since 2008 and gone up and down the scale by chunks of 30 or more pounds at a clip. How is this not fair or "making it personal" when Jimmy goes on and on about "folks like me" and "I'm healthy". Just because he doesn't think it is important doesn't make his nightmarish LDL any less so. He takes drugs to sleep and keep his fasting glucose in check and has compromised kidneys, and appears to have to dye his eyebrows. ;-)
Some could argue that McDougall got trolled. . . hard.
My provisional hypothesis: tryptophan is not an energy-efficient amino acid to catabolise into the TCA (check out the tortuous, vitamin-needy maze of tryptophan catabolism). When eating lots of protein, excess tryptophan is not absorbed, hence feces smell of indole (pungent metabolite of tryptophan also found in bitumen). When catabolising stored protein in a fasting situation, the tryptophan released maybe in excess of what the catabolic pathways can handle, and some is expressed in saliva or sweat as indole (it would only take a minute amount, mixed with other odours, for this to be halitosis), or perhaps in saliva as tryptophan which is then fermented by oral bacteria to indole and skatole.
See: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12663078
I think too many have gone overboard from one direction to the other. I don't recall the numbers so I'm going to use made up ones, but this is what happened with the LDL story and LDL being tied to CVD. I'll use X and nice round made up numbers. Guidelines were established for X where 500 was high risk for Y. So folks with X>500 were counseled. Then it was discovered that 50% of folks who experienced Y had X<500. So they lowered the risk threshold of X to 300 in hopes of catching more. It turns out this was not wise. But what they are doing now is wiser -- trying to figure out what about lower levels of X could still be problematic in some, or some other factor entirely. This doesn't mean that those original X>500 folks are off the hook. Their risk remains.
IF (and it doesn't happen to everyone but there's a substantial enough portion to fill sites like PaleoHacks and Jimmy's forum when it was popular with near daily panic posts about it) your LDL shoots up on a LCHF diet, it is probably not a healthy diet for you.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15601961
A randomized trial comparing low-fat and low-carbohydrate diets matched for energy and protein.
'Our results showed no significant weight loss, lipid, serum insulin, or glucose differences between the two diets. Lipids were dramatically reduced on both diets, with a trend for greater triglyceride reduction on the VLC diet. Glucose levels were also reduced on both diets, with a trend for insulin reduction on the VLC diet. Compliance was excellent with both diets, and side effects were mild, although participants reported more food cravings and bad breath on the VLC diet and more burping and flatulence on the LF diet.'
LF= Low-fat VLC= Very low carbohydrate
across the board, just like hunter gatherers. Yet whole food veganism
shot your cholesterol through the roof for many people. There wouldn't
even be debate of what's better for you. Someone low carb/paleo
devotees have tried to pull out every trick in the book rationalize their high TC and LDL and overblow the importance of HDL.
Every paleo dieter that has had even a borderline LDL or TC has also had
a high LDL-p. LDL-c obviously tracks LDL-p closely in most situations.
So much for the bouncy fluffly non-athrogenic particles that make your
high LDL desirable. Most paleo followers are following a diet that puts
them at risk for atherosclerosis but they don't even know it or are in
denial.
As if the story ends here;
> "look at me now"
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The reality is that most cardiologists consider cholesterol levels to be just another minor risk factor unless they suspect FH. The vast majority of non-FH patients who have heart attacks have normal cholesterol levels.
In Australia the official clinical guidelines recommend that the testing of LDL subfractions should NOT be performed because it has no clinical significance.
BTW Dr Robert Atkins was a leading Manhattan cardiologist.
What you write about the role of LDL-C in the pathogenesis of atherosclerosis is just plain WRONG. And "wrong" is a polite word in this context. You maybe shouldn't only read the cherry-picked bullshit that some self-proclaimed "experts" spew around (again, primarily in the US, strange isn't it...) but some hard data. Pubmed is open for everyone and YOU definitely have to do some very basic reading.
I commented on those I knew for a fact got free copies from VB or Jimmy.
Interestingly, Jason Seib tried to argue that he gains nothing from his review. Well, nothing one can see on paper but Jimmy wrote the Editorial Review for Jason's book ... and his podcast has turned into an infomercial to launch every new book coming down the poop shoot.
So he probably sent out a flurry of PDF's to those that didn't already have them and "encouraged" a review be posted. Wink wink ... do me a favor, you'll never know when you need one from me.
Cardiovascular Disease Resulting From a Diet and Lifestyle at Odds With Our Paleolithic Genome: How to Become a 21st-Century Hunter-Gatherer
James H. O'Keefe, Jr. M.D. and Loren Cordain, PhD
Perhaps no scientific topic has generated more controversy and confusion in recent times than the question of the ideal human diet. Medical experts espouse divergent views of
human nutrition with evangelical zeal, each citing scientific data to validate their respective contradictory conclusions. This confusing dialogue is epitomized by the
Atkins vs Ornish debate. The Atkins diet includes high protein, high saturated fat, and avoidance of nearly all carbohydrates. In contrast, the Ornish diet consists of 80%
carbohydrates and minimized consumption of all animal protein fats. Proponents of both diets insist theirs is the answer to the American epidemics of obesity and cardiovascular disease; however, the advice for these diets is mutually exclusive and diametrically
opposed. In truth, the ideal diet is neither of these extremes nor what many medical professionals now promote. In a recently published large review of approximately 150 studies on the link between diet and cardiovascular health, the authors concluded that 3 major dietary approaches have emerged as the most effective in preventing cardiovascular events:
(1) replacing saturated and trans-fats with monounsaturated and polyunsaturated fats;
(2) increasing consumption of omega-3 (ω-3) fats from either fish or plant sources such as nuts; and
(3) eating a diet high in various fruits, vegetables, nuts, and whole grains and avoiding foods with a high glycemic load (a large amount of quickly digestible carbohydrates).
Despite common misperceptions, this report found no strong evidence for a link between
risk of cardiovascular disease and intake of meat, cholesterol, or total fat.
These broad characteristics are consistent with the diet that Paleolithic humans evolved eating. This is the diet that our hunter-gatherer ancestors thrived on until the advent of the agricultural revolution. Through the millennia, our genome and physiology
became adapted to this diet. Of course, this diet varied by paleontological period, geographic location, season, and culture, but many characteristics remained consistent until recent times
SO - please tell me how the paleo diet evolved to be an excuse to eat bacon, meat and more bacon?? In Jimmy's case 80% SATURATED FAT!!
It makes NO SENSE
Lower Is Better and Physiologically Normal
James H. O’Keefe, JR, MD,* Loren Cordain, PHD,† William H. Harris, PHD,* Richard M. Moe, MD, PHD,* Robert Vogel, MD‡
The normal low-density lipoprotein (LDL) cholesterol range is 50 to 70 mg/dl for native hunter-gatherers, healthy human neonates, free-living primates, and other wild mammals (all of whom do not develop atherosclerosis). Randomized trial data suggest atherosclerosis progression and coronary heart disease events are minimized when LDL is lowered to70mg/dl. No major safety concerns have surfaced in studies that lowered LDL to this range of 50 to 70 mg/dl. The current guidelines setting the target LDL at 100 to 115 mg/dl may lead to substantial undertreatment in high-risk individuals. (J Am Coll Cardiol 2004;43
If our genetically determined ideal LDL is indeed 50 to 70 mg/dl, perhaps lowering the currently average but elevated levels closer to the physiologically normal range may improve not just CHD but also many other diseases commonly attributed to the aging process. For all of these reasons, and given the safety record of statins, some investigators have suggested that statins be considered for routine use in individuals over age 55 years.
SO - Loren Cordain is also co- author of a paper that not only advocates LDL-C of 50 - 70 mgs/dL BUT also suggests that statins be given to EVERYONE over the age of 55!!
Now the paleo people will tell you that he's changed his opinion on saturated fat but I've NEVER seen anything from him changing his position on LDL-C!
SO - what would Jimmy's excuse be? To dismiss Cordain along with Dayspring, etc.?
Some of the reviewers did already write them on their websites ... mostly smaller players. He was on like every podcast no matter how obscure as well.
Still no speaker list for the 2014 cruise ... guess he wasn't invited to the oh so "primal" outing to Tulum in March (Sisson & Wolf)
I am pretty sure every low-carber has at one point (if not many times) attempted calorie restricted diets and failed on them. That is why today in 2013 they are on the low-carb bandwagon. That is why new dieting programs keep emerging every other week, because the conventional wisdom is not effective.
There are many low carbers who are dedicated to not eating starch or sugar, yet gain weight staying 100% on that plan. I used to interact with a few of them (not Jimmy) regularly on Jimmy's forum. Because you can be LC and consume too many calories. Combine that with the denial that calories have anything to do with weight and .... blammo.
The thing is that LC is no easier to stay compliant on than calorie counting. But it works for some and that's great ... and then it mysteriously stops working despite being so so very good. One of the first things I tried when I had plateaued out was to go back to bare bones induction. But since I was not eating a lot of carb on my VLC days, there wasn't far to go. That's the thing, and when Gary Taubes delivered the news that some obese are so metabolically damaged even leafy greens and blueberries keep them fat, I cannot think of much more cruel than to say such a stupid thing to rescue one's failed hypothesis.
It may not be desired for quality of life, or easy, but the calorie counter can at least cut calories more (or increase expenditure). You can't go lower than almost-zero carb and there's no way that I'm aware to create a carb deficit once one's glycogen is depleted. Do you know of one?
I disagree about the biomarkers in terms of the significance of differences. There are also a lot of arbitrary "this biomarker is more important than that one" designations being made.
and LDL-P in some people, at least he was honest about it. If these folks have low triglycerides and high HDL we simply don’t know if they are at increased risk. If you have high triglycerides and low HDL, the risk is well established.
Concerning my speculation that you may have CARB syndrome, as I admitted in my post, I could be wrong. Many of your followers who visited my Facebook page don’t believe CARB syndrome exists. If that’s truly the case, it doesn’t make any sense to worry about a disease that doesn’t exist.
If you don’t like using the CARB syndrome model because it is unproven, then use Hudson and Pope’s established Affective Spectrum Disorder concept. The CARB syndrome model is simply an expansion of their concept. They do include eating disorders in their model.
If CARB syndrome does exist, you are in the best position to decide if you fit the pattern I have described. You say you had insomnia on a low carb diet and I don’t find that surprising. Many low carb diets like Atkins are very poor choices and there can be a lot of side effects. I agree with you that Paleo and low carb diets can be too restrictive in some cases, resulting in unwanted side effects.
I agree with you on many points. I am certainly not a traditional “low carb” fan. I believe in “smart carb” eating. If you get your potatoes from a can of Pringles, don’t be surprised if you end up being a metabolic train wreck with a brain that doesn’t work. If you eat Greek potatoes (potatoes, lemon juice, olive oil) then you’ll probably do just fine. The acid
in the lemon juice and the healthy fat in olive oil slow the absorption of the potato, avoiding brain-frying glucose spikes.
I believe that the traditional Mediterranean diet is one of the healthiest ways to eat and this diet has lots of healthy carbs. When they eat bread, they never just stuff in their mouth—they use it as a soaker to mop up the vinegar and oil from the left over salad dressing or meat drippings. Again this slows the absorption of the carbohydrate in the bread. I don’t eat a lot of bread because I think there are more nutritious foods to eat but when I do eat it I also use it as a soaker.
In my opinion processed foods are the problem and this type of food contains a lot of refined carbohydrates. It also contains a lot of sugar and bad fats, creating a deadly combination.
CarbSane—If I was “barking up the wrong tree” when I suggest that you might have CARB syndrome, that’s good. Congratulations on enjoying excellent health. Perhaps if we spent a little more time in constructive conversations we would find that we have a lot in common.
Perhaps if we spent a little more time in constructive conversations we would find that we have a lot in common.
Not that I have any desire to, but at what point in this process did you attempt to engage in a constructive conversation? I must have missed that. The prudent thing for you to do would be to disengage at this point, methinks.
I have read a lot of your blog posts, and I don't get it. What do you suggest that someone like me, 42 years old, female, 270 lbs and 5'2" do? This is the highest weight I have EVER been. I have binge eating disorder clearly. You say the "mythical" blood sugar roller coaster. Well, I am pre-diabetic, have PCOS, insulin resistance, hypo thyroid, and NAFLD. Who knows, it might be full blown diabetes right now, but I'm too afraid to go to the doctor to have that diagnosis on my record. I had gestational diabetes with both of my babies. With my first, I ate a VLC diet and checked my BS religiously. I never felt so good! My "mythical" blood sugar roller coaster was EVEN and I even lost weight in that pregnancy (I could afford to). I forgot to mention I dealt with infertility for years until I went on a clean eating low carb diet and BAM, got pregnant that first month at 38 years old. Went on to have my second baby at 39. No fertility drugs needed after all.
I don't get what diet you are for. I know you are against keto diets and low carb diets, that is clear. I've done Weight Watchers, calorie counting, Nutri System, low fat, veg*n, and excessive exercising. Remember, I have an eating disorder. Oh, and depression and anxiety, there's that too. I had hope for a low carb diet, because I've always felt the most healthiest on them. But reading your blog just makes me even more depressed and want to give the heck up.
What gives?
How's your diet? What do you eat? Are you healthy?
I'm super confused and just want to give up.
My point with this post, and I'm sure I have some others, though they may have been on my no-longer-existing personal blog, is to highlight that there are downsides and these are better dealt with by acknowledging them than ignoring them.
If you have a fair amount to lose, and you choose to do it LC, then you'll probably want to find some sort of cycling plan that is doable for you because the odds are really against you that such long term carb restriction will not have some detrimental effects. I've met so many -- women especially -- who have taken months/years to undo the damage.
If you listen to some of these women they *sound* perky -- because they are on! -- and then when the cameras go off, so do they.
Have you considered getting help with the eating disorder? I would highly recommend that you do, because such a professional would be able to help you figure out why you binge. NO diet will do that, and ultra restrictive diets just play into the restriction-induced "common" version of BED. (I firmly believe that a goodly portion are these benign ED while fewer are rooted in some non-diet behavior related cause)
What do you eat in an average day?
What meds are you on? For example do you take any thyroid medication?
Have you had a recent HA1C test done? Have you had complete blood work done recently (lipid panel including NMR and/or VAP, CBC, Vit D3, Mineral test - Magnesium, potassium, iron, etc.)
You say you've tried Weight Watchers, calorie counting, Nutri System, low fat, veg*n, and excessive exercising.
Have you tried therapy for your eating disorder, depression and anxiety?
There is a book called The Beck Diet Solution which uses cognitive behavioral therapy to help overeaters, bingers and emotional eaters learn how to manage their impulses. You might want to give it a read. A lot of the solution is just managing your expectations. I spent a few weeks whining to myself that it wasn't faaaaaiiiir when I started Weight Watchers, but then one day I realized that the whole measuring and tracking business took less time out of my day than dental hygiene and I just stopped fighting it.
There are roughly three ways to lose weight; choose food from a restricted list of repetitive and not overly stimulating food (low carb, vegan, Ornish/Esselstyne, Weight Watchers Simply Filling), pre-portioned foods (Jenny Craig, Nutrisystems, protein sparing fasts), intake tracking (Weight Watchers Points Plus, standard calorie counting with or without a smartphone app) and a few hybrid plans. They all work. The human species is remarkably flexible in its tolerance of dietary variation. If a moderately low carb diet works for you, great, but it won't be a magic solution. It also won't have any particularly good or bad health effect. Get your other issues under control (depression, anxiety, alcohol, sleep issues, whatever -- get therapy, if you need it) and then just pick a method and settle down for the long haul.
But the new guys from modern times, when there's too much information don't have a comfort of being excused from not knowing.
Yeah, because we know how to separate the DNA of the rich from the poor and can cite more circle jerk blog posts to reinforce such a view. And that NONE of this comedy material (wishful interpretation of history) has jack to do with the questions posited to Jimmy Moore on that baitcast--err, podcast.
Apologies. You were talking about warped views?
Normally, I would be opposed to any kind of "fat shaming" but in her case it's probably OK since she does so much of this to people like Jimmy Moore (who although a bit of a clown - is a thoroughly nice, well-meaning person who has actually lost and kept off 100's of pounds despite occasional fluctuations that are the natural consequence of a life of poor eating and a rise in the set-point)
I too was once overweight but after reading an article in Readers' Digest by Gary Taubes in 2011 radically changed my weight and my life and feel great to this day eating virtually no carbs for weeks at a time. Low Carb isn't as easy for women though and I don't discount the problems some people may face with it (I'm not closed minded like CarbSane aka Evelyn)
Hope you see this before Evelyn deletes it and blocks me - she's big on suppression too.
Normally, I would be opposed to any kind of "fat shaming" but in her case it's probably OK since she does so much of this to people like Jimmy Moore (who although a bit of a clown - is a thoroughly nice, well-meaning person who has actually lost and kept off 100's of pounds despite occasional fluctuations that are the natural consequence of a life of poor eating and a rise in the set-point)
I too was once overweight but after reading an article in Readers' Digest by Gary Taubes in 2011 radically changed my weight and my life and feel great to this day eating virtually no carbs for weeks at a time. Low Carb isn't as easy for women though and I don't discount the problems some people may face with it (I'm not closed minded like CarbSane aka Evelyn)
Hope you see this before Evelyn deletes it and blocks me - she's big on suppression as well.
I don't see the point of your post. Do you think Jimmy Moore is in a position to dole out diet advice even though he is morbidly obese and sickly - in all probability due to the diet that he strictly adheres to? Do you think the brick-of-butter-and-eggs diet is healthy and sustainable? I'm pretty sure that Left Footed, who has an eating disorder, does not need to listen to Jimmy Moore, who is in denial about his eating disorder.
I honestly had my best success (in 2005) with Weight Watchers. We started having meetings at work and I quickly became very competitive with my co-workers and lost a lot of weight quickly. I also over-exercised too so I could earn points to eat back. So, yes, I still binged back then too, and I quickly learned what was the best bang for my buck and found myself binging on Kashi bars (gag!) and fat free everything. As with any diet I've been on, soon my BED took over my life again and I rebelled and ate all the way back up to my starting weight and then some (everyone's heard the story!)
Thanks for taking the time to listen. My doctor who is a low carb advocate has even warned me not to go too low carb because he's heard about it burning out thyroid function.
My goal is to be healthy for my two boys. Right now, I am far from that. And just so lost.
What I eat in an average day. Hmmmm....right now, a ton of junk/fast food. In fact, my drawer at work has a ton of Easter candy and other chocolate goodies in it. This is part of my BED. I get anxious if I don't have "easy access" to lots of junk. As far as the fast food crapola I eat, a lot of it is because we are in the middle of renovating a new house (have been since June of 2013!!) and we have the contractors from hell, and no kitchen to speak of. We do have a kitchen where we are living right now, but have kept most of our dishes, pots and pans, etc. packed up because we were supposed to be moving in "just a little bit, so why bother unpacking.....) I feel like I'm stuck, I'm living in what is supposed to be a temporary house that will soon have been our home for almost 2 years come June! I've basically put my life on hold this past almost 2 years thinking that I could start tackling healthy eating once we got settled into our new house. Now I want to kick myself because look at how much time I've wasted and how much weight I've put on. I was about 230 after the birth of my youngest and have gained over 40 pounds since then living like this.
I know it sounds like I'm blaming my environment a lot.....I know.....but depression and being in what feels like an impossible situation can make someone do that. Oh, I forgot to mention all the issues with my husband that I'm having....I've seriously wanted to check myself into a psych ward on many o' occasions the past couple years.
Okay, as far as meds, I am on synthroid, .075 mg. Klonopin as needed for anxiety. I am supposed to be able to take up to 2 a day, but knowing my addictive personality (and having abused Ambien in the past), I am pretty strict about only taking one at night to help with sleep.
I have severe OSA and sleep (pretty compliant) with a CPAP.
Last year, I had a kidney stone for the first time ever and via lab work was told that I had NAFLD. I pretty much knew that already though considering what my diet consists of. I also had to have surgery to remove the stone and had to have all the pre-op stuff done. Oddly enough, blood sugar (A1C) was 'normal', under 5.5. Lliver enyzymes were elevated, triglycerides were elevated, EKG was normal and blood pressure was normal (110/70). Thyroid was functioning normally with the dose of Synthroid I am on. (I've been on it since January 2011.) Vitamin D is low (23 I think?) but I do supplement with D3 when I feel like taking care of myself. Which lately isn't that much. Iron is fine. I believe magnesium and potassium were fine too, I don't remember the doctor saying anything about them. I have been prescribed Metformin (1500 XL per day) and I don't always take it religiously, again, only when I'm trying to care for myself. I'm on it for the PCOS/pre-diabetes.
Yes, I'm in therapy and have been for a long time. Have tried two different IOP programs as well, as well as being in patient for a week (mainly to be detoxed from abusing Ambien, but was also treated for depression and ED at the same time). Have a psychiatrist. Am not taking any anti depressant now, but I've been on a whole bunch of them in the past. Zoloft, Prozac (made me suicidal!), Wellbutrin, buspar, a couple others I can't remember the name of....
Thanks for listening. I'm just so stuck. I swear, if it weren't for my two little boys, I'd seriously probably have tried suicide at least a couple times by now. My marriage sucks. But I'm sure I have a lot of blame in that.
Thanks for not laughing me off this board. I've never even put all this out there before.....(only to my medical/therapy team). So, I'm feeling a bit vulnerable right now.
But I have to say, I do think that there are a lot of low carb "advocates" or "experts" that don't seem to be all that healthy to me. Like Jimmy Moore. I've always felt weird about that. But the promises they make about never being hungry again....all my health woes being cured.....etc, etc, etc is very tempting.
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss.
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining it.
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss....
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss......
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss........
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss...
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss............
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss!.
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss.!
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss.!!
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss.!!!!
She lives in the proverbial glass house - dishing out insults at Jimmy Moore, a man (who I'm no fan of) that obviously has severe genetic and past eating induced issues (i.e. a high set-point). These preclude him from staying at what we would term a healthy weight. Nevertheless - he's a far cry from his former self as anyone can see - unlike Evelyn Kocur aka carbsane.
Low-Carb doesn't work for everyone - it appears to become less and less effective with the progression of time spent on the american diet - and is never quite as effective for women - due primarily to estrogen.
It is however, the most effective tool in the toolkit for weight loss and sustaining that loss.!!!!4
"Hey Left Footed - Evelyn never answered your question about whether she is healthy - You can in fact listen to her own podcasts on Jimmy Moore's podcast where she talks about her current obesity and carb-binges. Simply google "*****" to learn more.
Normally, I would be opposed to any kind of "fat shaming" but in her case it's probably OK since she does so much of this to people like Jimmy Moore (who although a bit of a clown - is a thoroughly nice, well-meaning person who has actually lost and kept off 100's of pounds despite occasional fluctuations that are the natural consequence of a life of poor eating and a rise in the set-point)
I too was once overweight but after reading an article in Readers' Digest by Gary Taubes in 2011 radically changed my weight and my life and feel great to this day eating virtually no carbs for weeks at a time. Low Carb isn't as easy for women though and I don't discount the problems some people may face with it (I'm not closed minded like CarbSane aka Evelyn)
Hope you see this before Evelyn deletes it and blocks me - she's big on suppression as well.
________________________________________________
So let's address "Lipid Logic" who created a Disqus account to leave the comment on my blog.
1. I have not fat shamed Jimmy. This is Jimmy's straw man argument. His weight is an issue because his reason for having a platform is his personal story. Only his personal story is not one that bears out his claims. Jimmy is ALL about "look at me" when his latest scheme is working for him, and all about "don't look now" when it fails him yet again because he is using diet to attempt to cure an eating disorder with other underlying issues. This man CHOOSES to live his personal life as his "professional life".
2. Jimmy Moore is a liar. This has been shown over and over, and it is a serious pathology with him, because he lies about things that anyone who has ever read his blog knows are untrue. For example, when he was losing and had lost the weight with NuttyK, he was giving speeches using the slide here. This slide is a clear lie.
Why does Jimmy continue to highlight his weight loss if he doesn't think it is relevant?
Because .... health.
Aside from his abominable lipid panel and deteriorating glucose tolerance, Jimmy has underlying kidney health issues he has mentioned briefly but doesn't seem to want to address as important. This is his perogative not to discuss them, as well as whatever other challenges of a personal nature he chooses not to reveal. BUT, he can't do that and say his diet is healthy ... even for him ... because if he were locked away in a Pritikin center for 6 months I can practically guarantee you he would come out a healthier man for it.
As to the rest of the post, my critics forced my hand beginning in 2012 to remove personal focus from my blogging. If you want to know the details of that, they are all here on the blog.
I'm pretty sure I know who LL is. This person is not open minded, and if they think I am closed minded on dietary issues, they clearly haven't read more than three words on this blog.
There are no longer pictures on this site because this is NOT a personal website, it is similar in some ways to a site like authoritynutrition, or perhaps even paleoleap which doesn't even have an about page. This is also an action I have taken, which I will not explain, on advice of legal counsel since 2012-13.
Now please go away.
It's just no snacks, no sweets (including soda), no seconds except for sometimes on days that start with 'S' (weekends and special days). I found it really helpful for learning how to eat like a normal person (pre-obesity epidemic). Add a short stroll after every meal to deal with your blood sugar issues, and you'll be good to go.
Thank you again, Kitty!
Apo B versus cholesterol in estimating cardiovascular risk and in guiding therapy: report of the thirty-person/ten-country panel
"There is abundant evidence that the risk of atherosclerotic vascular disease is directly related to plasma cholesterol levels. Accordingly, all of the national and transnational screening and therapeutic guidelines are based on total or LDL cholesterol. This presumes that cholesterol is the most important lipoprotein-related proatherogenic risk variable. On the contrary, risk appears to be more directly related to the number of circulating atherogenic particles that contact and enter the arterial wall than to the measured concentration of cholesterol in these lipoprotein fractions. Each of the atherogenic lipoprotein particles contains a single molecule of apolipoprotein (apo) B and therefore the concentration of apo B provides a direct measure of the number of circulating atherogenic lipoproteins. Evidence from fundamental, epidemiological and clinical trial studies indicates that apo B is superior to any of the cholesterol indices to recognize those at increased risk of vascular disease and to judge the adequacy of lipid-lowering therapy. On the basis of this evidence, we believe that apo B should be included in all guidelines as an indicator of cardiovascular risk. In addition, the present target adopted by the Canadian guideline groups of an apo B <90 mg dL−1 in high-risk patients should be reassessed in the light of the new clinical trial results and a new ultra-low target of <80 mg dL−1 be considered. The evidence also indicates that the apo B/apo A-I ratio is superior to any of the conventional cholesterol ratios in patients without symptomatic vascular disease or diabetes to evaluate the lipoprotein-related risk of vascular disease."
What was Jimmy's the last time he posted it? I believe it was 238.
As you've discovered, weight loss is a lot more complicated than finding the magic macronutrient balance. Support and reasonable expectations are a lot more important.
DR BRAYBFULOY AGREESCWITH ME I BETVTHATVCHAPS YOUR FAT ASS
Stroke
mortality and the apoB/apoA-I ratio: results of the AMORIS prospective study
The principal finding in the present study was the strong, direct relationship between increasing values of the apoB/apoA-I ratio and the risk of fatal stroke. The apoB/apoA-I ratio reflects the balance between atherogenic apoB lipoprotein particles, VLDL, IDL (intermediate density lipoprotein), and LDL, and antiatherogenic apoA-I lipoprotein particles, HDL. Furthermore, the relationship between the apoB/apoA-I ratio and the risk of stroke was significantly stronger than for the TC/HDL and LDL/HDL cholesterol ratios. Both apoB and apoA-I contribute to the risk of stroke. In fact, a low apoA-I value was the single strongest contributing factor to an increased apoB/apoA-I ratio and to risk as it was significant in different subtypes of stroke including also haemorrhagic and subarachnoidal strokes. We also found that low HDL cholesterol was as common as a low apoA-I value. In this regard, our HDL cholesterol data are in agreement with previous reports
In conclusion, these are the first findings that link both apoB and apoA-I to the risk of stroke. Furthermore, the results also suggest that disease in the cerebral and coronary vessels are both influenced by the balance between atherogenic and atheroprotective particles and in that regard share a common pathophysiology. These data also demonstrate that the apoB/apoA-I ratio is a more accurate index of that critical balance than the conventional cholesterol ratios and constitute further evidence that the apoB/apoA-I ratio should be adopted as the best summary index of the lipoprotein-related risk of atherosclerotic disease in clinical practice.
I believe I once read a response to Mora, but can't find it. Anyway, there has been some controversy, but it sounds like most believe that at some point apoB/LDL-P will replace the the standard lipid panel. Since LDL-C is not a useful factor for determining who is at risk for heart disease, I wonder if apoB/LDL-P could really single out people at high risk, or does it just offer a better measure response to treatment. As I recall the recommendation is only to get cholesterol checked every 4 to 6 years for most people anyway.
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