Maybe Caging the Animal might be more appropriate at times

I'm not sure the wisdom of making this post, but something I read yesterday on Nikoley's latest post on Jack Kruse just didn't sit right with me.  Were it not for the fact that Dick did his best to contribute to the angst of the past going-on two weeks, I probably would just let it slide.  He's just not the sort of blogger I have ever had much interest in.  I can't relate, and, frankly, he's so cryptic at times as to be exasperatingly annoying.  Really, it's almost as frustrating as having a discussion with Fred Hahn, and anyone who ever has ended up getting talked in circles (as opposed to getting talked circles around) by Fred knows what I mean.   

So any way, here was Dick's first post on Kruse.  You see, he had "inside information" having spoken to Kruse on the night of Jan. 9 when Kruse claims to have undertaken his now infamous epic biohack -- complete with elective surgery, MRSA, no local/post op pain management, and 120 lbs of ice.  Here is what Dick wrote then:

Let's back up to January 9th, the day of his surgery. By coincidence, Jack had been trying to reach me for a few days, and after obligatory phone tag, I settled down to a glass of whiskey on the evening of January 9th and rang him up, having no idea of what was in store. He answered, and something seemed way though he'd been shot and was lying in a puddle of his own blood, bleeding to death. Nope, it was worse. He'd been in 40ish degree water for some hours (under supervision) at that point. He told me all about what he was up to, swore me to secrecy and that was that. I made sure he was under supervision and was eating during the experiment, because he was intending for a long haul in the icy water.
And in comments to Melissa McEwen:
Wait for his Factor X and yes, putting out stuff piecemeal is irritating. He does have an interesting epicenetic argument, on the surface for me. Of course, I’m unqualified. It’s interesting, though. Probably nothing anyone expects.
Not sold by any means, but I have some lines to research. 
And now?  In a post ironically entitled Dr. Jack Kruse, Neurosurgeon, is a Big Fʊ₵ Dick writes:

Addendum (5/17/2012): ... First of all, I talked to Jack by phone—basically a mini-interview—in advance of my first post about him and the controversy involving Leptin Reset and Cold Thermogenesis. I thought both protocols had merit and wanted to spread the word. I'd already seen his Tedx Talk and how he described having had surgery without general anesthesia, went home, had his wife and daughter pack him in ice, etc., etc. As I asked him about all of this over the phone he added that it was that night, January 9th, that I had spoken with him on the phone.
Ever been in a conversation with someone and out of politeness, don't call them on an inconsistency? Perhaps he's mistaken. I didn't actually know which specific evening I'd spoken with him and it's 3 months later. So, maybe he's mistaken about the day. Give it a pass.
Now in retrospect, perhaps it was very important because, you see, for three months I had in mind that when I called, Jack was doing a major CT self experiment. I forget how many hours he said he was going to do, but:
  1. He said not one word about having surgery.
  2. He said not one word about injecting himself with bacteria.
When I asked why he was doing this, he said, "chronic back pain." He also said that his family had no idea he was doing this, that he had taken time off work to do it, had someone watching over him, and that he was eating during the experiment. So, the Tedx talk 3 months later is the first time I hear about the bacteria, surgery, and that his family was involved in the ice packing. Still, I didn't not connect that with my previous conversation with him because there was essentially nothing about the stories that were the same. So when he claimed our conversation was that same night I should probably have not given it a pass, but I did.
Whoa up there Dick!  I know you're a cryptic dude, but how does the story above mesh with your blogging of April 3?   Surely after 3000 posts you've got the art of relating things as they went down vs. what you now say is, what?, Jack's story?   
Next, during that same phone conversation in advance of my first post, he told me about his "Factor X" and I believe my response was along the lines of 'huh, interesting.' Later, in his podcast interview Abel James, that somehow gets translated into "Richard was totally blown away!" I think he even said it twice. Perhaps it would have been nitpick of me to bring it up then, but not so much now.
The thing is Dick, you were more than happy to tease over Factor X back then.  This doesn't imply your were "blown away", but at least intrigued in the "maybe this guy is on to something" sort of way.  If it were not for what transpired in between these two posts, complete with Dick counseling me that it is unnecessary for me to call a fraud a fraud when I see one, this post probably never happens.  But I just can't let this go without calling this guy out here.  But first, here's a list of all posts I've made here on Jack (if I've missed any, please feel free to add in comments).
It's unfortunate there had to be this many, but I think everyone is now painfully aware of what happens when there's some quiet collective biting of tongues in fear of retribution or harming some movement or such.  Why bother with this?  Well, more for the older stuff and history for those that still think I'm just about ad hominem attacks for one.  Since practically day one of mentioning Jack, I've been pointing out problems with his science and expressing publicly that I didn't believe him early on. Sure I have a little fun with my Leptin Man Lego and whatnot, and called him a quack out of the gate, but the crux has always been exposing the nonsense in his "science".  So this just gets it all in one tidy place.  In the first Kruisegate post, this ties into Nikoley's involvement here.  Blog posts, throwing the c-word around and more wild speculations aside, my beef with Dick of a personal nature boils down to those threatening tweets and his continued speculation on his blog over my involvement or whether or not I was named to him by Jack.  I may not have Emily Deans' training, but I do know that when folks are angry and/or possibly tired and/or drinking, what they do and say is likely closer to the truth than when they soberly compose a blog post.  And those threatening tweets can be apologized for, but not removed from the record. Nor can the fact that Dick claims to have discussed with Jack how he should take civil action.  WHY would you counsel someone you think is a liar?  Ahh, yes.  That's right.  Dick didn't have enough information yet to conclude that on his own, despite what (no doubt several) "people" tried to tell him.  It took that fake picture to finally get through.  

And you know what?  That's fine.  Some people seem to like to extend the benefit of the doubt moreso than others -- though I kind of doubt that same benefit would be given to someone like, say, yours truly.  It's more the manipulation of this story for some glory of record page hits and comment counts that got a rise outta Dick that leaves a bad taste in my mouth.  Because if there was any deception involved here, there can be no doubt that Dick was neck deep in passing that along to his readers.   He recants the events of Jan 9th as if they were how they went down according to his recollection.  Now, to be fair, he didn't say Jack told him specifically about surgery and MRSA, just "He told me all about what he was up to, swore me to secrecy and that was that."  But now we learn that Dick's recollection was that {paraphrase} 'he said nothing about surgery or MRSA' and {quote} "When I asked why he was doing this, he said, "chronic back pain." He also said that his family had no idea he was doing this, that he had taken time off work to do it, had someone watching over him, and that he was eating during the experiment.".

Dick milked this for what? The glory of page hits and comments?  Hundreds of comments about MRSA and the surgery, and let's not forget another inconsistency with today's story mismatches.  Kruse claimed at TEDx that his family had no idea what he was up to, but learned post haste after the surgery.  Dick says a half dead sounding Jack told him his family had no idea what he was up to even then.  SIGH.

Look, I don't think Dick had anything to do with the inception of what is increasingly looking like Jack taking advantage of an unfortunate event for publicity at best, a hoax at worse.  But he sure as hell got himself neck deep involved in the flurry with that three c's tweet, and he sure as heck is guilty of allowing rank speculation and whatnot on his blog that generated publicity and sympathy for Jack when he could have informed his readers of his own serious concerns to clear up a lot of this a month ago.  Imagine if instead of "I think this has merit", Dick had also expressed his concerns.  As in, why are we just NOW learning that Jack's story of the events of 1/9 doesn't mesh with Dick's own recollection?  Why are we just NOW learning that Jack supposedly talked about a back injury in the private phone call, but got up in front of a TEDx audience and claimed MRSA/surgery?  Really.  WHY NOW AND NOT THEN?

Really folks.  If a close friend of mine did this I'd be questioning -- at least in my mind -- what was going on with that person.  But Jack seems nothing more than an acquaintance to Dick.  And yet he stays silent to his readers over this and seems more than happy to let the sheet fly.  OK.  Who am I to question.  But in light of what he KNEW, even if he didn't share, this makes his tweets and subsequent blog posts ever the more inexcusable.  Does having a popular blog not carry with it even a small iota of accountability to act in a calm and rational manner??  Is it really too much to ask that someone think before they jump to conclusions believing Jack over ANYONE?  

I'm still waiting.  Is there ONE person who came off that cruise who witnessed what went down according to Jack?  Even when this story broke, there were enough facts out there to question this.  I knew I had nothing to do with it.  I also knew when I learned of this at 1am that Tuesday morning that I had a final exam to administer later that morning, and I envisioned if the FBI took this seriously it would not be unprecedented for them to contact me at work.  Who needs that eff show?  And ya know, I've always wondered over those who get worried when they have nothing to worry about.  I won't any more after this, because I knew there was no "there" there, but still I about jumped out of my skin when the screen door was opened w/o a knock last week, and they tried to put mail through my (taped up) mail-slot in the old fashioned door.   Many a life has been ruined for false suspicions and those people rarely get their lives back.  ... Oh ... someone in the audience thinks this is still what happened to Jack?  Hmmph.  He went to the media with this, they didn't come to him.

Bottom line, Richard Nikoley could have, and should have been more forthcoming with his concerns over Dr. John Jack Kruse.   In direct fashion, not cryptic circle jerks.  That he is doing so now just smacks of a lame attempt to save face.  But in doing so he has exposed that he was along for the ride all along.  For shame.  Truly.  And for all who say I needlessly label people here?  Well, I've never titled a post "Fill in the blank is a f'en liar" ... and I never will.  And when I learn information inconsistent with the public record or the science as we know it, I will call it out.

Oh ... and one last thing.  If Dick really feels any remorse, shame or whatever over this, may I suggest:  Reveal Factor X!  I'm sure there's an out there, even when sworn to secrecy, when the person lied to you.


Samson Parado said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
Samson Parado said…
Richard revealed factor X in the comments to his post:

Richard Nikoley // May 17, 2012 at 23:37


You ready? Careful, you might be “blown away”

Factor X: An asteroid hit the planet way back when, but it did so on a southern trajectory, spewing all the dust and ash southward, which, once everything evened out, still left a bit in the arctic region of the north and probably everything died except for those who could survive the cold.

That’s basically it. As Jack said, I was “totally blown away.”

What's more interesting than any of this is the bongo59 stuff. Apparently Jack's trolled NFL and Disney forums for the last decade, lied about insider information, and been kicked off forums by moderators.

When someone asked if this was true, and he was actually this bongo59 person, Jack denied it.

Well, that's lie number 21,235 there, because he is bongo59 for sure, according to this neurosurgery report:

Have you EVER seen someone lie so often, especially someone who is entrusted to operate or sick people's spines and brains? (not to mention his suspension from a neurosurgery board for lying under oath). And the Kruse followers will continue to obliviously ignore and call it a conspiracy against Kruse. Sad.
Harry's Acolyte said…
He saw which way the wind was blowing and wanted to try to get in everyone's good graces. He knows that he looked like a total jerk but thought that he could finesse his way through it with the morons, just like he sort of did with his c-word justification. (People actually gave his explanation credence!?)

Nikoley likes being liked, which is funny given his contrarian fake persona. He also gets off on being able to brag about his site stats. He surely came to realize that it was all in jeopardy due to his friendship with Kruse. He simply saw which way the wind was blowing and stabbed Kruse in the back accordingly.

Not that Kruse deserves any more or less.

PS - I'm interested that Dr. Kurt has not posted at Nikoley's site since the c-word debacle. Perhaps he can weigh in here.
CarbSane said…
HA! So Dick lied to his readers again? Thought it was epigenetics. Asteroid?
MM said…
I think it's really good that you gathered all of this background story together in one place. It's so easy to forget what really happened, and sweep it under the rug. However, it's been bad from the start and only got worse and more crazy. I'm glad nothing came of it. Interesting that Nickoley is trying to change his story. Thanks for calling him on it!

"I've always wondered over those who get worried when they have nothing to worry about. I won't any more after this..."

LOL! That's a good thing, because this is so me! :)
Let's see how much longer before other LC bloggers start distancing themselves and claiming they knew he was a wacko all along.... I actually like reading Fat Head, and hubby wears one of his Wheat Kills tees, but he got the story wrong (mentioned the threatening tweet right off in recent blog entry). Really? The guy who uses parody and humor and exaggeration to some quite interesting effects of his own can't understand a parody/humor/"outing of nuttiness" twitter account? This is what Fathead wrote:

"You’ve probably heard by now that one of our speakers, Dr. Jack Kruse, was pulled off the ship after someone tweeted to Carnival that he was bringing a biological weapon aboard. I met Dr. Kruse on the flight from Nashville, and Chareva and I later shared a ride to the hotel with him. The next day he was gone and we never saw him again. More on that later."


Onward:Clearly, Dr. K likes to...embellish? Is this the word? So many inconsistencies seem to follow this guy. And how convenient he got all that media attention to sell out that webinar. So, any bets on what Factor X is gonna be (if it's not icebaths).

Me, I a still waiting for the great investigative journalism write up (and that's not to say your critiques haven't been valuable).

Some sacred cows need to be moved to a separate pasture cause they done gone "mad cow".
an3drew said…
There is a certain type.... I'm no psychiatrist, so my lay conclusion is that these people fall within a type.... of person who is talented enough to lie and bullshit and get people to buy into whatever they're selling. And many of these people seem to find their way to the Internet. Kruse is clearly of this type in my opinion.

From the first time I read his crap I knew what he was all about. I tried to speak up but I'm nobody, so right along with the other nobodies who saw it I spoke up and no one listened.

I was involved with helping a false war hero once and Kruse reminds me of this guy, from the way he lied to the types of lies. And guess what..... when people started picking through his online lies, he cried "hacker!" too.
an3drew said…

I was involved with helping EXPOSE a false war hero once....
Heaven's to Betsy, please tell me this is a joke, like, Richard being amusing. Cause if not...well, okay...maybe this is totally Kruseian after all. The free animal wrote this as being FACTOR X:


You ready? Careful, you might be “blown away”

Factor X: An asteroid hit the planet way back when, but it did so on a southern trajectory, spewing all the dust and ash southward, which, once everything evened out, still left a bit in the arctic region of the north and probably everything died except for those who could survive the cold.

That’s basically it. As Jack said, I was “totally blown away.”

Sure, if there’s real to it, worth considering and so forth. But that would be science, not factor x.~~

Dr. K is pulling an L. Ron.
Yeah, but hey, we got to hear what Factor X was. And why he was "blown away". Snarf.
ItsTheWooo said…
Like a true sniveling coward, Nikoley jumps on the Kruse-bashing wagon when his ego no longer sustains electrical jump start thrills by being associated with his (heavily disgraced) name. Kruse has reached such epic levels of public ridicule and unpopularity Nikoley is sustaining narcissistic injury just by being associated with him. This public lambasting of his supposed ex"friend" demonstrates the appalling lack of integrity of Nikoley. The more he attempts to redeem himself, the more he shows what a truly abhorrent individual he is. It's like watching someone struggle in quicksand. Now we know Nikoley is not only a coward, a misogynist, someone with a profound abusive streak, and a liar ("cunt is a term of endearment!") but we also know he has no personal integrity and freely snitches/rats on his buddies for personal gains, a turncoat.

The respectable thing would be to, like Rob Wolf, and pretty much everyone else, would be to slowly distance yourself from this (crazy nut) person. Make it known you do not agree with their endorsements/statements/claims in a tactful way. No one expects one to be chained to a mentally ill pathological liar for life, but the professional/stable/mature thing would be to slowly, quietly, non-dramatically part ways with them.

It does not reflect well on you as a human being to gut and ridicule your supposed "friends" this way. Kruse has been lying and saying insane things all along; what makes the FB picture (OBVIOUSLY not him) any different than any prior Kruse circus antic? Why does this act deserve such a harsh public abuse of your so called friend?

It's apparent the guy is trying to undo his mistakes; he now realize Kruse is a dead end and he wants off this titanic. The blog entry is a desperate misguided attempt to reclaim esteem, to get in good with the in crowd. He figures being the crap out of Kruse publically will mitigate the way everyone now thinks of him. Actually, no, it just makes everyone more sure that you are an asshole, but thanks.

It's like watching a pair of imbecilic villains in a childrens movie fight amongst themselves.
julianne said…
Did JK get someone to call Carnival I wonder? (A great opportunity to create havock and get on nationwide news)

What does JK's wife think of all this craziness associated with her husband? Am I the only person to wonder about what his wife and kids think?
There was a nasty reply to one overreaction when the commenter stated the "them" weren't fooled by JK to begin with, and Free Animal just gets...mean and snipy. There's some aggressive stuff going on with him that maybe he should delve into more than he does the cold thermogenesis stuff. It's quite scary and more than a bit unhealthy seeming. Like the profanities when the G word is mentioned. It's just not...mature or controlled. I mean, controlling food and body is great, but how about controlling temper and defensiveness?
The idea I'm sure has occured to many (ie, setting up the call). But I wouldn't speculate on that openly. I figure the chips will sort out. Give it time. Truth sometimes takes time.
Sue said…
That nasty reply was to me which I thought was OTT. But I was replying to the commenter.
ItsTheWooo said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
ItsTheWooo said…
She might be one of those so proud to be a doctor's wife that she tolerates all sorts of disrespectful abhorrent behavior. It happens particularly among the older crowd; some women married to prominent men will tolerate just about anything. Of course this is just speculation, who knows the reality.
Samson Parado said…
In the show Dexter, there was season in which the villain was John Lithgow as the "Trinity Killer".

John Lithgow's family had absolutely no idea what was going on inside his head, except for the occasional moments when he was a huge/scary jerk to people. He was a very giving person, and very charismatic in public.

Now I'm not saying that Jack Kruse is a serial killer. At all. He is a doctor that tries very hard to reach out to people and aid them in getting healthier. Please please note that is example a joke-like analogy. A PARODY IF YOU WILL.

But it is easy for people to see charismatic + smart + schmoozey, and think that anyone who criticizes such a person must be a hater. That might be the case here. It feels a bit slimy to speculate about somebody's family life, but when someone markets themselves so heavily as a guru and puts out some crazy ass shit, this is peanuts.
Christopher said…
Forget a Factor X reveal - he needs to start with a simple, unambiguous apology to you. Just my opinion...
Christopher said…
Oh yeah... I love the fact that people like Woo have recognized common cause and set aside rivalries to embrace intellectual honesty at its finest. Very cool. Love it when the smartest people in the room are able to get along...
Jason Sandeman said…
JK - dude was a douche from the start. My favorite claim? That he "cured" T1DM with a "spinal adjustment."
I remember laughing so hard I cried. Then I promptly forgot about him. Not worth my time. I don't play well with stupid.
A person can be bright/gifted but still be stupid. Jack proves it. I'm sure he woul be a brilliant man, and a great contributor, if only his ego wouldn't get in the way. Like, gosh! You might actually be wrong. Learn from it, crush it, move on.

Instead, plow on. It's like refusing to admit you took the wrong road, And the one you're on ends in a cliff. No worries though, we'll just plow of the cliff and explain it as if that's what we meant ti do.

Unknown said…

Susan // May 17, 2012 at 16:44

This is a response I would expect from you. Frustrated are we? To damn bad, live with the consequences of your actions. Again, you are a friend I could live without.

You can live with the mediocre world you conjured up in your mind.

LadyoftheCave // May 17, 2012 at 18:19

I didn’t read this directly, so I’m one-off quoting – but doesn’t Kruse say that is good for you? Can we interpret this as support for his methods?

<—amused with herself.

Richard Nikoley // May 17, 2012 at 18:58


We’re not friends. Ought I put a duh there?

Go fuck off too. Eh?

Now go report me to forums. I’m an asshole, a shithead. And I don’t give a runny shit or a wasted fuck what you do.

Are we clear, yet, cunt?

Richard needs help!!
Leighan said…
Indeed he does...Shameful...that's no way to speak to a lady!
CarbSane said…
I'll leave these comments despite the vulgar language for the sampling of his behavior. I think along with Jack Kruse, Richard should be disinvited from speaking at AHS12. I never really read him much before, and hadn't read him in a long time. He sounded so uncharacteristically level headed with his mod carb posts and reassessment of the Colpo/Eades fiasco. It was short-lived. Frankly 20 minutes of webcam footage from the Bronx Zoo would lend more to the ancestral community.

Between the 3 or 4 Jack threads there must be hundreds of comments defending the use of that word. He even seems to delight in mocking any woman who considers it offensive -- our panties are too bunched! He seems to delight as well in thinking he's hurt people. I am neither hurt nor offended by the word itself, it's the person and the intent of his use. Something Beth has mentioned on a few occasions as well. I've always been "one of the guys" and when you go to a college with a 5:1 gender ratio and work in male-dominated fields (less so now, but not when I was "coming up") all your life and can count quite a number of lovable dogs amongst friends. This man's just a dog and I pity anyone who thinks his behavior is somehow cute.
Unknown said…
I think we should organize a march against the C word and keep on marching until it is driven off the face of the earth, nay, the entire solar system.

There is no place in civilized society for it.
Is it wrong to wish for a "c*nts against Angry Dick" march at AHS12? Like during his session?

I just think if he's going to really own this behavior he should display it in public and not just on the tubes.

But be careful what you wish for, eh?
Sanjeev said…
> Go fuck off too. Eh?
>Now go report me to forums. I’m an asshole, a shithead. And I don’t give a runny shit or a wasted fuck what you do.

>Are we clear, yet, cunt?

jeez ... I can just feel the love

And this is a few days (a little over a week I think?) after he claimed it was a <snicker>term of endearment</snicker>, huh?
Sanjeev said…
I'm in if I can carry a lit torch & a pitchfork, wear bib overalls and chew on a straw.
CarbSane said…

Unknown, you're going to be at AHS12 right?

Beth -- if he's still on the docket, I'm game to have T's made up and organize. :D Just so long as I don't have to miss anything good that's opposing him. Please oh please organizers of AHS12. If you have to have this guy talk, put Attia or Eenfeldt up against him. Please!

He says he wants to buy me a drink. I'll let him if he calls me that in front of a live audience. Either way, I win and he's still a loser for digging in heels on this nonsense!
LeonRover said…
Be careful, he might sic his wife (Bea) and Germaine Greer on ya.

Those '60's Aussie women are shock&awe-some!!!

Ho, ho, ho & a bottle of rum.
Richard Nikoley said…
Evie dearest

Sorry for the non-nested reply. Blame it on Steve. iPad seems to have this issue on blogger.

....Anyway, I did go up against Eenfeldt, at AHS11. We both had good crowds, mine a bit bigger. He was a total sweetheart about it, introduced himself to me on day one and we had fun back and forth one who would draw the most.

I never back out of an offer to buy a drink and I never worry much about how badly some people think of me. Goes with the territory and if you can't take it, don't be a blogger.

So, y'all have fun. See you at AHS.
Richard Nikoley said…
Oh, and Beth, in all seriousness I would love that t-shirt if you design it.

I'll sell it on my site, all proceeds going to the charity of your choosing.
CarbSane said…
How people feel about you has nothing to do with being a blogger.
CarbSane said…
Say it ain't so. Dick would sick the skirts on me? Ha!

As fun as this is, the fact remains that in April Dick led his readers to believe that he spoke to Jack the night of the surgery/MRSA incident. Didn't want to clue them in that there were inconsistencies, like ... eh ... he now recalls no such storyline, only chronic back pain.

Part of helping your audience make up their own minds is giving them the straight story, as you know it. But that wouldn't have generated as many page hits and comments.

Only now JK did something so utterly stupid Dick needs to save face and pretend he wasn't along for the ride all along. Poor guy!
As a member of the conference committee, I believe I have an invite to the speakers dinner on Thursday. So if there's anything good opposite his talk, perhaps you can be my plus 1 and we can let him call one or both of us a c*nt at that venue.
Richard Nikoley said…
Well, of course no...unless you care a lot what people feel about you, which was the—duh—point. I don't know what your regular modus is here, but I've never pre-moderated a comment since I started blogging in 2003, and I only delete them when obvious spam or proved trolling, which is super rare.

How does that compare to the average in paleo land? In fact, I don't otherwise comment on blogs I might, because everyone seems to quake over what some independent mind with different values, experiences, levels of outrage or adoration might say about them. I prefer to "post-moderate," which includes the use of 4-letter words. It has a cost, but I don't expect anyone to understand.

But, sorry to go over your head once again with a "cryptic" comment. My commenters are hugely international, including many current and former xpats. There's an affinity because of my living abroad for years. We're worldly to the extreme, and I'm not used to having to spell things out, and even the American commenters, which are most, are largely of that cloth. That's what _I_ like.

Carful, or we'll fart in your general direction, and insult you for a send time.
Richard Nikoley said…
Alright, Evie.

So, I went to great lengths to post that comment. Had to log into my server at my company so as to be from a different IP, and it went right through after numerous tries from home.

I respect property and if I'm not welcome to post 2 comments after the 86 I welcomed from you at my place, then just tell me.

It could be it's just a glitch, so it's not an accusation, just a request for clarification. Just let me know whether I'm welcome or not to comment at your place.
Richard Nikoley said…
The previous comment from before (damn you blogspt you make it so hard and Evie, consider a Wordpress blog):

Well, of course no...unless you care a lot what people feel about you, which was the—duh—point. I don't know what your regular modus is here, but I've never pre-moderated a comment since I started blogging in 2003, and I only delete them when obvious spam or proved trolling, which is super rare.

How does that compare to the average in paleo land? In fact, I don't otherwise comment on blogs I might, because everyone seems to quake over what some independent mind with different values, experiences, levels of outrage or adoration might say about them. I prefer to "post-moderate," which includes the use of 4-letter words. It has a cost, but I don't expect anyone to understand.

But, sorry to go over your head once again with a "cryptic" comment. My commenters are hugely international, including many current and former xpats. There's an affinity because of my living abroad for years. We're worldly to the extreme, and I'm not used to having to spell things out, and even the American commenters, which are most, are largely of that cloth. That's what _I_ like.

Carful, or we'll fart in your general direction, and insult you for a send time.
Galina L. said…
@Wooo, as a medical professional, could you tell please,how much the person in maniac state understands that something wrong is going on with him? I think Dr. Kruse is just mentally unhealthy and unable to behave and act reasonably, because some things are just too abnormal. I can't believe he could went through all stages of his education and worked as a surgeon while being in his present state. I know you are not a big fan of MDs, but I assume only reasonable people can perform a complicated surgery.
ItsTheWooo said…
Manic people have very poor insight and this is characteristic of the condition. The more manic a person is the less they can see anything is wrong. A person who is in psychotic mania can be so impaired they seem schizophrenic.

I am leaning more toward Kruse being a pathological liar and a narcissistic psychopath at this point. His behavior is calculated and organized which suggests he is not manic. However, it is clear he has a profound need for attention praise and worship (cult-guru) and it is also clear he thinks nothing of making up obvious mind boggling lies without finching, suggesting profound sociopathic traits (no ability to operate within boundaries of right/wrong, no concern for right/wrong).

NPD / antisocial traits seem disturbingly common amongst "paleos" as this silly religious cult emphasizes grandiosity, egocentricity, and has a marked emphasis on disregarding modern society. This is appealing to a narcissistic psychopath, as appealing as the atkins diet is to someone who likes hamburgers and bacon.
Nikoley himself shows classic signs of being a low level narcissist/sociopathic abuser, which may be the very thing that lead him to worship other successful narcissitic/sociopathic icons like Jack Kruse or the character in the Baldwin movie he shamelessly admitted to idolizing.
Richard Nikoley said…
Is it the woo?

Someone recently commented on my blog about how I ought to check yours out (I think it was in the Kruse Big Fat Liar post) because of how you kick ass and take names, like...

I think I recall you from comments at Stephan's place. Sciency. My recollection.

Anyway...and this serves as a poor reply to both your comment and nested reply, but thanks so much for the free psychoanalysis. Amazing insight, seeing as you've never met me, talked to any of my 30 employees, attended any of our Christmas parties or anything...or even talked to my first wife, the one I married when I actually got married for the first time at 40...and she her first time too, at 42.

That'd be hard though, as she's working on her 29th year of teaching 6th grade and having been hand picked as a group of stellar teachers going into an absolute hell hole of a school next year to fix it, where the principle and all the teachers have been fired or moved.

Oh, excuse me, but it's 2am and I'm going to go cuddle up to her gently, and the 13-yr-old Rat Terrier—Rotor—my "baby" with whom I've walked over 10,000 miles with, and who who sleeps with us every night.

But isn't it great to feel like you know someone? It must be.

Feel free to send me a bill. I assume you can find my email. It's on the about page of my blog.
CarbSane said…
Richard, you're welcome to comment here all you want. I don't moderate comments except for the Razwell flurries that blow through here from time to time. The above comment went to Spam and I just saw that this morning. I have no control over what Blogger filters and would prefer to opt out on that but there's no option to do so. Blogger v. WP, been meaning to make that switch for almost a year now. If Blogger forces the issue with their new (crappy) dashboard interface, I'll probably do the switch.

As regards cryptic comments, I'm talking about the ones directed to me or about me. I don't have time to try to decipher them, that's all.
bentleyj74 said…
"There is no place in civilized society for it."

I don't think I agree. I'm inclined to think the ONLY place anyone utters "the word" is in civilized society [or if they actually do want a physical confrontation]. The habit is imo extremely reliant on other people playing by the "rules". Ill advised under all other circumstances and evidence of having been quite sheltered. It's the sort of thing privileged kids do [around each other] to feel all gritty and alpha and channel Jack Palance and stuff like that.
Nigel Kinbrum said…
Well, colour me psychic!

Richard, have you considered the possibility that "low level narcissist/sociopathic abuser" could be a term of endearment for your internet persona?
Galina L. said…
I think many people avoid reckless behavior like an easy-to-detect gross lying not only because it is morally wrong but also out of sense of self-preservation (and ,sure, most people have no desire to accumulate long list of gross lies). It looks like Dr. Kruse set himself on a crash course. However, many such people live their lives while manage on the edge of disaster and their charisma carries them through life - president Clinton is a good example. John Edvards was not so lucky. They crave adoration as well and their sense or right and wrong seems to be very questinable.
I think, you don't do justice to every Paleo blogger or follower by bunching them all in the same pile with Dr. Kruse. Modern life prone to make people soft, weak and prone to illnesses, and many spent 20 years in small cubicals like caged animals and feel they are ready to rebel in some form not necessary against society but against the life they have. They just want to feel more alive, and I think that their bacon and meat eating activity and participating in paleo-blogs doesn't rock our society at all.
I try to avoid defending people on internet. Also, I never noticed Richard being thin-skinned or super-sensitive or particularly defenseless and in a need to be protected from any form of criticism. I just want to tell I see him quite differently then you, from what he writes, he is a rather lay-back guy who sometimes lets his steam out in a verbal form. May be my impression is wrong, I don't know. I want to give him a credit for not being afraid to admit publicly being wrong. Not typical for a narcissist. Even many non-narcissists can't do it easily.
Richard Nikoley said…
"internet persona?"

No, no Nigel. See, there's no "internet persona." I go around through life calling everyone c-words between and in conjunction with stages of excessive drunkenness, falling over and generally crapping on everyone I come across.

Clearly you have been confused to think that I might have a certain shtick I employ on my blog but not "real life." As if. Sheesh.
CarbSane said…
It would appear that's what happened. But we'll never know. Because I doubt the FBI even cares anymore and I can only hope the TN medical board authorities do.
Richard Nikoley said…
Oh, you get Razwell too. Another soul I tried to save, but there was eventually no choice but to put him in the moderation queue. Clear trolling. And worse.
CarbSane said…
BTW ... only friends call me Evie, you are not a friend.
CarbSane said…
BTW, I don't know that anyone has ever met/talked to his wife. I can see not bringing your wife to a PaleoFX thing, but not bringing her on a cruise? You pay double (or significantly more) for the single room (and I can't see him signing on for a roomie) anyway, and you'd think he'd want his wife to have a nice vacation too, right?

I'm pretty sure I asked Richard if he asked to speak to Jack's wife that night. Not sure if I did or if he responded. I do know that this was my first comment on this matter over at Richard's:


As one who has had my fair share of criticism of Jack from both a scientific POV and just having fun with his quirks, I’m hoping you’ll hear me out on this.

I, too, relate to him on some levels. We are around the same age and grew up in the same area, though he in the city and me in the burbs. I can relate to his “dreamer” side. But I cannot tolerate BS. For the Leptin thing it was no nevermind mostly. Except that when someone feels bone-chillingly cold and they can’t warm up, to respond that “that’s what you want”??

While there’s apparently someone who has survived 2 hrs in ice water, Jack’s claims of spending 2 to 4 hours PER NIGHT in a tub of ice water. This is where he loses me with the tall tales. You mention the cold plunge is 40 deg. in the Men’s area but 60 in the Women’s. The cold plunge at the resort I was just at was at 60 deg — I didn’t think to confirm with hubs that his was at the same temp. In any case, then, shouldn’t Jack at a minimum have different CT protocols for men and women if there’s some scientific reason behind why there was a 20 deg difference in the temps of the cold plunges for the genders at your club? Do not reports of LINGERING numbness at least raise red flags?

None of this comes close to the injecting MRSA claims. Believe them or not, your friend is teetering on the verge of professional suicide if not more dire consequences. This goes so beyond n=1 experimentation. It’s one thing to experiment on yourself with ice baths, eating nothing but meat in the winter, summer carbfests, whatever. It’s quite another to make this outlandish claim of injecting yourself with a potentially deadly agent and going under someone else’s knife in a medical facility. I DON’T BELIEVE HIM. But if you do, think about what this says of the mental state of a husband and father of two doing what he claims. This goes beyond the whole bucking the system, thinking outside the box, whatever … This is DEAD serious shit.

Either your friend is losing grip on reality (my guess) or he’s a pathological liar doing what he’s doing for unknown reasons. He is risking his professional career and perhaps his life. If it were my friend, I’d be on the phone to him and his wife to intervene. Just saying …

Nobody seems to want to even try to intervene here. And there was lots of ridicule flying over at FTA for any who dared "OMG MRSA!". I'm sorry, but I can't get over this visual. I'm imagining being on the other end of that phone call and I'm just not getting the whole "made sure he had eaten something and was being supervised" thing. I would ask, do you have someone with you? LET ME SPEAK TO THEM PLEASE.

So Richard had all these reservations all along here and didn't think to even share them in matter of fact fashion. He certainly still believed enough in Jack to go on that Twitter rage. Ahh well.
CarbSane said…
He's talking about reversing T1 still in comments on his latest blog post. I'm not sure these days he's in control over his actions, and yet they are so calculated and there's a consistency there that makes me think perhaps he benefits from folks thinking that. You know, "oh that's just harmless crazy Jack spouting off again".
CarbSane said…
Razwell used to be rather amusing when his rants were all about how nobody understands obesity and Bacon & Friedman love fests. But he's much worse than that. Which is another reason why I'm no fan of Jimmy Moore. To break internet silence during his grieving period after the failed embryo adoption to respond to the (banned) Razwell on his forum to take a poke at Colpo, there's the true Jimmy right there. Meanwhile I've never posted a nasty thing on any of his venues and I'm banned from all of them.
Richard Nikoley said…
I didn't ask Jack to speak to his wife that night because he's told me almost immediately that none of his family new what he was up to. He said he's taken time off work to do this, made it sound as though he was someplace other than home and his family thought he was doing something else--though not entirely sure, it was over 4 months ago, now. But he certainly said nothing about surgery.

I explained in my post that I had detected the inconsistency once I saw the TEDx talk, then talked to him on the phone and he told me that was the night I had spoken to him. I didn't know whether he was mistaken or not about which night I talked to him or if it's true I did, then the stories are clearly inconsistent, so one's a lie. I decided to give him a pass at that point.
Richard Nikoley said…
"BTW ... only friends call me Evie, you are not a friend."

You flatter yourself. Understandable, though, since I always comport myself in a friendly manner in the comments or forums of others, since it's their place, not mine and I have no reason to expect them to conduct their own affairs the way I conduct mine.

Since you choose to tag me with a nickname I've never gone by in my life, and which my mother loathes, I figure a little turnabout is fair play. I'm sure you have something in your mind's eye when you use that with respect to me. In my mind's eye, I'm talking to a homely adolescent girl, patting he on the head, saying it's alright. Just because all the other girls don't like her at school, it's no reason to go trying to find faults in all the boys.
Richard Nikoley said…
Razwell added value to comments at my place for a long time. A bit repetitive, but nothing to worry about. Then when I realized I had been wrong both about Colpo as well as the "LC magic" stuff and in particular, reached out to Colpo and now we're fine and dandy, exchange emails and stuff, Raz went bonkers. I let it pass, hoping it would blow over. It didn't. I put him in the mod que, saying I'd publish anything that was value-add and not the same stuff he does over and over. He tried for a comment or 2 or 3, and then went right back, including bombarding me with emails.

I should have learned a long time ago you can't rescue people. Tried that with a few women way back when, and that didn't work out either.
CarbSane said…
Therein is the lie you should have shared with your readers from the get-go, no? You related the events of that night as if that's what he told you at the time. You certainly didn't intimate that his TEDx version where his wife and daughter/surgery/MRSA were all involved differed from your recollection in the original post. Why not? You gave him a pass, you didn't give your readers the full clue and so a wild crap-fest ensued (amidst the semantics garble) and someone (perhaps even you?) called me to the carpet for misinterpreting his Leptinmanese tweet about the events of the night.

If he said he wasn't at home I would have asked to speak with whomever he claimed was supervising him. That's just me though. Common sense says settling in for the long haul packed in ice or ice water or whatever is not sane behavior.
CarbSane said…
I always comport myself in a friendly manner as well, part of which is respecting the person and calling them by the name they go by and not assuming some degree of familiarity you don't have with the person. Addressing me as "dearest Evie" is patronizing nonsense and you know it (and everyone sees through it too). Mind games aren't my thang. Most of my friends here don't even call me Evie mostly because we've probably never exchanged emails and that's usually when I sign my name that way and it tends to stick even if I don't point it out. Most here I would be delighted to have call me by that nickname. As for Dick, well ... call someone a c*nt and eh, that's already the turnabout and not intended to be endearing. You're the oddest sort of passive agressive I've come across in a good long while.
CarbSane said…
As far as Razwell is concerned, I've been dealing with him since the vile PM days at Jimmy's forum in 2009 or early 2010. He followed me back here to this blog from James Krieger's blog and ranted on. When it gets into the racist and other stuff, I won't tolerate it. Therefore all goes to Spam. He was beyond saving long before you ever encountered him. I'm sure a woman or two tried to save you along the way too. Sheez you remind me so of a-holes from my 20's. You'd think being married to the lovely Beatrice all these years mighta tamed at least some of that, but I'll leave the psychoanalysis to Wooo and chuckle from the sidelines.
Richard Nikoley said…
OK, Evie Dearest.

Shot across your body, which I know you can take. But don't you all go touching yourselves too much. I'd fear for your eyesight.
Richard Nikoley said…
oops, I seriously meant "across your bow" (ex-Navy guy).

Chers and smiles and waiting breathlessly for your next.
Galina L. said…
Com-on, Richard, what possessed you to behave in a stupid manner by annoying people on purpose? Higher ground suits you better. We know you like verbal exchange, but right now it looks like you lost.
Richard Nikoley said…
Why, Galina L?

Are you as important as them?
Galina L. said…
Richerd, I know very well I am not important at all, and , probably, it was not really appropriate for me to say anything on the subject(sorry). I have being reading your blog for a while, and I know you are a fare person. I hope you will understand that my remark was also in your defense, because it was painful to see the person I respect behaving silly. It happens, me saying something in a such situation is on a silly side as well. As a blog host, you accumulated followers who respect you and as a result have certain expectation. I know you can very well send me to hell together with my expectations, but decided to voice my opinion anyway. Being somebody who is not important is convenient because what I say doesn't weight much, and I have no desire to slap people.
Richard Nikoley said…

Not what I meant by important.
Nigel Kinbrum said…
The internet is an infinite source of LOLs & sights that encourage my eyesight to deteriorate. ;-p

Don't like the internet, oh no. I love it!

P.S. Richard, get rid of that POAS and use something with a proper keyboard. Yor speling iz atroshus!

P.P.S. What did you mean by "important"? Don't expect people to read your mind.
Galina L. said…
You are welcome, Nige,
Sometimes the only comfort to a person who could't resist to say something in the situation when she/he had no business to interfere is the thought somebody is enjoining the comment anyway. Yes, we discuss sometimes things which are important, but also web-activity is a huge source of entertainment.
Sorry, Richard, it was not my place to tell you how to behave.
Richard Nikoley said…
You're right. I should have, and I regret not doing so.
CarbSane said…
You're an ass Dick. Howzat?

Oh, and you might want to read up before calling Wooo some sort of regular participant here or female (you seem to have a problem with them in general) sycophant.

Bizarre you chose to counter a review of your book in this manner, but have at it.
Richard Nikoley said…
"You're an ass Dick. Howzat?"

It's fine, I suppose. I get called worse sometimes in my own comments.

"Bizarre you chose to counter a review of your book in this manner, but have at it."

Yea, I suppose. Oh, well.
ItsTheWooo said…

Ya know what, richard, it's 5:30 am where I live and I just don't have time to wade through the stupid you have inflicted on the interweb. I am flattered you have characterized me as some kind of ANTI-MANIMAL, OPPRESSIVE FEMINAZI. I imagine my costume for this role will be something like the matronly teacher with hair tied tightly in a bun, permanent scowl on face, and a grey suitdress...or perhaps, the tattered rags of a fragile female gone lunatic shut-in screaming hysterically? Which stereotype shall I be?

Here's a little tip for you. If people criticize you when you act like an abject fucking asshole, it might not be because there is something wrong with other people, and they can't take your RADICAL, IN YOUR FACE, MOUNTAIN DEW CODE RED-NESS. It might be because you are acting like an asshole and people don't like thorns, bad smells, or assholes.

I like that you have used my comment as a springboard to air out your crazy sexist theories. Sort of like saying "John recently accused me of being a racist, which I totally AM NOT... however, I must say things have gone a bit downhill since we freed the slaves, and I also think there are some positive benefits to white only water fountains, and interracial breeding is white suicide as well!"


Also interesting a subset of men on your forum are basically like "WHY ARE WOMEN IDIOTS?" and the women are like "I KNOW WE ARE! WE ARE NOT DESIGNED BY THE PALEOLITHIC TO THINK, I GUESS!"

Extra lol points: you lump myself, carbsane together as if we are some mass entity specifically because we are female. Are you new? Do you realize I spend more time ranting/arguing carbsane than agreeing? Great way to prove you aren't a misogynist though BTW.
This just in, OJ simpson and Obama are totally the same.

You need to get over this idea that if someone criticizes you or insults you , it means they are trying to cage you up, keep you down, enslave you. Your narcissism is showing. Asking for respect /decent behavior is not violating your rights and only a narcissistic psychopath would assume this the case. You are free to act like a jerk all you want, just as I am free to respond and say "god damn it nikoley is a jerk". What you are NOT entitled to, is chronic jerk behavior and having everyone say "what a wonderful kind man that Nikoley is".
Galina L. said…
Yes, I interfered because I couldn't stand to watch how Richard was making fool of himself, he is not a Razzwelt, after all.

I worked in both predominantly male and predominantly female environments and had a chance to notice that different genders have different patterns of irrational behavior. When guy do something on a stupid side, they usually demonstrate un-mature behavior, for example , from time to time for the purpose of relaxation (my guess) guys (I would say all of them) say something fit only for an arrogant male teenager, mostly they do it in the 100% male company, something like a balls rearranging. Sometimes my husband says "You will not believe it, but for the whole lunch break in a lunch room guys were discussing sizes and shapes of penises". They are all educated responsible people, good and even devoted husbands and fathers, but there is not always correlation between who they are in life and what they say in a time of relaxation. I asked my husband why many non-idiotic males could say something what could easily pass for a chauvinistic remark, and he said that it was a sport-fun type of behavior - cheering to own team.
There is typical male unreasonable behavior and typically female unreasonable behavior. We are different in ways to be silly. Honestly, I found it to be more easy to deal with male-type silliness. It is not women being idiots while guys are shining example of permanent sanity,we just silly in different ways. Often unreasonable female acts like a bitch, while unreasonable male like a maroonic adolescent. I have an impression that a teenager personality survives better in males, in the preparation for a "mother" role in life we (females)are getting more serious, and, in the relation to Richard's therm, more "important". It doesn't mean all sort of silliness supposed to be mutually ignored. People should be getting honest feed-back in most cases, and why not to accept a reasonable criticism? However, I think not always jerk-talking guys are jerks.
Woodey said…
Actually I take back what I said about "nothing personal" with Dick "Les" Nikoley, the guy's a total groin snorkeler. Sh*t the air that comes out of my dog's *ss has more value than anything he says.

Thank God for the internet! Its been empowering mental midgets and wackjobs since 1991.
Woodey said…
Les take the pill! Life for you will take a hard turn for the better!
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